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Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 29 Jul 2008, 17:21
by Pxtl
Evil4Zerggin wrote:Beamlasers have an engine-hardcoded 30% overshoot >_>. So HLTs can reach 806 range via FPS/radar targeting/missing, although they will only target at 620.
No, this was actually targetted. The "defense ranges" widget was showing a range, and I had radar dots, but my vlaunches were showing less range.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 29 Jul 2008, 17:33
by Forboding Angel
Would it be too much to ask that the comm be given 5k/5k of storage (not starting resources mind you, just storage ability). Or even 2.5k/2.5k would do the trick nicely.
O also, minintensity=1; in your laser weapon fbi's. Use it. Did anyone happen to notice that a gheytor are max range does about 47 damage per sec. Flash at max range dishes out a full 116 per sec.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 29 Jul 2008, 17:48
by KDR_11k
Forboding Angel wrote:O also, minintensity=1; in your laser weapon fbi's. Use it. Did anyone happen to notice that a gheytor are max range does about 47 damage per sec. Flash at max range dishes out a full 116 per sec.
Doesn't make sense for BA, it's balanced for the existing behaviour.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 29 Jul 2008, 18:03
by ginekolog
Forboding Angel wrote:
O also, minintensity=1; in your laser weapon fbi's. Use it. Did anyone happen to notice that a gheytor are max range does about 47 damage per sec. Flash at max range dishes out a full 116 per sec.
Interesting, i did not notice that. Is this the same for all beam weapons(beamlaser=1;)? What is the formula.. 50% of power at max range?
Btw just changig that would be horrible for balance...
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 29 Jul 2008, 18:07
by Evil4Zerggin
Code: Select all
float intensity = std::max(minIntensity, 1-(curLength)/(actualRange*2));
By default, damage decreases linearly to 50% at max range, then stays at 50%.
Good Post
Posted: 29 Jul 2008, 18:53
by [Krogoth86]
ginekolog wrote:Interesting, i did not notice that. Is this the same for all beam weapons(beamlaser=1;)? What is the formula.. 50% of power at max range?
Yup - it's like that for all beam weapons. That's why I asked for this being fixed for at least some things like the Annihilator back then. It isn't just crap because of the stats is has but gets even more sucky by just dealing half the damage at max range and because of the huge range and reload time you just lose hell of a damage potential...
Fixing this also doesn't necessarily break the balance like completely as you can see in Maximum Annihilation. There beam weapons always do the full damage and after playing around a bit I kept lots of stats at their original BA value as it had the nice effect of making defenses (well in BA mainly at T1) a bit stronger rendering things like flash spam less effective while supporting the use of artillery and such - don't know if Noize & Co like that for their mod, I did...
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 29 Jul 2008, 23:21
by Forboding Angel
Crap, peet deleted one post too many.
Actually it would help flash gheytor balance in particular quite a bit if they were minintensity=1; the damage lowered from the insane values that they are now.
LLT's would benefit from this as well.
Cans and Sumos (and to a lesser extent Gimps) suffer from this debilitation as well.
In a game like BA it is painfully noticeable if you are familiar with the way spring works.
Oh fark, he deleted my entire outline post (the one post too many bit) explaining how this behavior affects the game. Fark.
Comm storage would make the game a bit easier on newbies, even something super small like 1.25k/1.25k or 1.5k/1.5k would do the trick nicely. It raises the ceiling just enough.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 01:11
by Gota
I dont think making it easier for noobs isa good thing.
Were alking just easy to play not easy to understand.No reason to do that.
Anyway there are alot of noob traps in ba that ill give you.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 03:12
by Pxtl
Raping n00bs is so ingraned in BA gameplay that it would take a complete inversion of the people in charge to change it. I hate to admit it, but GOTA's right, in a perverse sort of way - making a decision to make BA more n00b friendly (that is, removing strategies that are just stupid pitfalls for newbs but are otherwise nuisances or utterly forgettable for experienced players) would be a long and complicated road for BA.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 03:58
by Gota
It would bring it to an already existing mod.
By the way,giving the commander more storage is not one of those noobtraps hence should not be added.
just adding If someone misinterpreted what i wrote.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 05:40
by Forboding Angel
Comm storage was just a suggestion, no biggie there.
Gheytor vs flash is a GLARING problem though. It is not balanced, it is nowhere even close. It is utterly broken.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 05:56
by LordMatt
1v1 FA (Arm) vs Sleksa (Core) @ comet. It's the only way to settle it.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 07:36
by Forboding Angel
Then a 1 vs 1 in evo?
Seriously though, the numbers don't lie. You can massage a migraine as much as you want, it's still a migraine. Actually, hell why not. Screens incoming...
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 07:53
by Forboding Angel
Numbers don't lie:
The gheytor damage at max range is actually less than I thought. It's 44 not 47.
The weapon that the gheytor uses:
Code: Select all
[GATOR_LASERX]
{
name=Laser;
rendertype=0;
lineofsight=1;
turret=1;
range=230;
reloadtime=0.77;
weaponvelocity=1000;
areaofeffect=8;
soundtrigger=1;
energypershot=0;
tolerance=10000;
soundstart=lasrlit3;
soundhit=lasrhit2;
firestarter=50;
beamlaser=1;
thickness=2.5;
corethickness=0.175;
laserflaresize=6;
targetmoveerror=0.15;
beamtime=0.1;
rgbcolor=1 0 0;
explosiongenerator=custom:FLASH1red;
impulsefactor=0.123;
impulseboost=0.123;
cratermult=0;
craterboost=0;
noselfdamage=1;
[DAMAGE]
{
default=75;
VTRANS=12;
L1FIGHTERS=9;
L2FIGHTERS=9;
L1BOMBERS=9;
L2BOMBERS=9;
GUNSHIPS=9;
HGUNSHIPS=9;
VRADAR=9;
VTOL=9;
L1SUBS=5;
L2SUBS=5;
L3SUBS=5;
}
}
Any questions?
Here's a thought. Put the gayto laser at 44 damage with a minintensity of 1 and give it's barrel a faster turn rate. That way while the flash would still win in a toe to toe fight at max ranges, gaytors wouldn't fail in close combat.
Also, but that flash is inside the gaytors max range a bit ad at total absolute max range the gaytor does 35 damage, but tbh you would never be able to micro a group of them THAT well because the range is roughly equivalent to a little less than a 2x2 footprint.
This should work nicely:
Before
Code: Select all
AimPrimary(heading, pitch)
{
signal SIG_AIM;
set-signal-mask SIG_AIM;
turn turret to y-axis heading speed <175.000000>;
wait-for-turn turret around y-axis;
start-script RestoreAfterDelay();
return (1);
}
After
Code: Select all
AimPrimary(heading, pitch)
{
signal SIG_AIM;
set-signal-mask SIG_AIM;
turn turret to y-axis heading speed <250.000000>; // or maybe even 300 for posterity's sake
wait-for-turn turret around y-axis;
start-script RestoreAfterDelay();
return (1);
}
There, I have pointed out a problem while providing a solution that should preserve the status quo and make gaytors much less frustrating to use.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 09:06
by Sleksa
Gheytor vs flash is a ~Glaring~ problem though. It is not balanced, it is nowhere even close. It is utterly broken.
I wonder why you are the only one whining about it here when other players, like Day, NOiZE, me, and everyone else have had very few problems regarding the gator/flash balance.
Then a 1 vs 1 in evo?
Your mod has nothing to do with this ~Glaring problem~ you brought up
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 09:33
by Forboding Angel
You know what? Listen to sleksa. His profound words of blathery astound even the most astute mathematician ...
I wonder why none of you and precious few of your playerbase play core as a mainstay (and how many of those core players are very successful)?
OH wait... That's too easy.
Me I really don't care what happens here. But this balance is so bad that even ChrisT himself would be ashamed.
Numbers don't lie sleksa. 1 + 1 does equal 2, no matter how badly you want people to think that it equals 3.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 09:39
by Hoi
I play core. I win.
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 09:41
by Forboding Angel
Hoi Wins Thread.
/thread
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 09:42
by Hoi
seriously, core owns arm's gay stealth/emp
Re: Balanced Annihilation V6.31
Posted: 30 Jul 2008, 09:48
by Forboding Angel
I said /thread damnit
*stabs thread repeatedly*
