Page 9 of 10
Re: What's wrong with XTA? (input for next version)
Posted: 08 Apr 2010, 18:44
by Gota
Air planes some units labs eco buildings..When you wrote you wrote all units..
Re: What's wrong with XTA? (input for next version)
Posted: 08 Apr 2010, 22:34
by raaar
I am amazed raar gets so much respect and patiance while suggestions of better players get ignored or trolled much faster.
you cant be saying a unit is oped or uped if ur not a good player youll just get L2P and rightfully so,even if your are actually correct.
People put too much emphasis on who the source is rather than the arguments themselves.
sacrificing complexity for easy learning is not the way to go.
One thing doesn't imply the other.
Excluding the "crazy" ideas of reworking xta, i think it would be improved if some less used units got buffed, by either making them stronger at their role, or making them more broadly effective. This would allow for more different unit mixes to be effective.
Re: What's wrong with XTA? (input for next version)
Posted: 08 Apr 2010, 23:08
by babbles
Glad you took the time to rebutt my comments.
Re: What's wrong with XTA? (input for next version)
Posted: 08 Apr 2010, 23:47
by JohannesH
raaar wrote:People put too much emphasis on who the source is rather than the arguments themselves.
Yeah, if you can compare stats you know how the game works
Oh and if a unit isnt used much doesnt necessarily mean it should to be buffed. Some units being more useful than others can create a better game, if theres a gazillion possible unit combinations that work at some time, the game can become a bit too unpredictable.
Re: What's wrong with XTA? (input for next version)
Posted: 09 Apr 2010, 01:41
by raaar
babbles wrote:Glad you took the time to rebutt my comments.
i'll get there on the weekend
Re: What's wrong with XTA? (input for next version)
Posted: 09 Apr 2010, 10:37
by manolo_
one cookie for babbs (please dont cry me a river)
Re: What's wrong with XTA? (input for next version)
Posted: 11 Apr 2010, 19:19
by raaar
I'll just throw a few more stats and go back to playing the game...
NOTE:
wCost = metalCost + energyCost / 60
Code: Select all
-------------- some misc lev2 units
NAME HP SPD WCOST RANGE DPS
core_crock / Crock 3510.0 2.0 556 360.0 56.8421052631579(48 aoe)
arm_triton / Triton 3023.0 2.1 560 380.0 62.22222222222222(48 aoe)
arm_zeus / Zeus 3100.0 1.5 590 240.0 131.0344827586207
core_the_can / The Can 5100.0 1.2 763 400.0 84.7
(zeus gets equivalent of 3500 hp when gun holstered)
arm_warrior / Warrior 2690.0 2.8 700 360.0 102.5
core_pyro / Pyro 2240.0 2.0 396 300.0 180.0
core_leveler / Leveler 5769.0 1.85 809 360.0 210.0
arm_panther / Panther 2430.0 3.0 836 280 120
704 15.5
core_gimp / Gimp 7910.0 1.2 1492 450.0 110.66666666666667
core_sumo / Sumo 10000.0 0.8 2595 780.0 258.5714285714286
core_goliath / Goliath 22920.0 1.1 5093 600 394 (144 aoe)
250.0 36.666666666666664
arm_bulldog / Bulldog 7867.0 1.65 1448 420.0 105.55555555555556(64 aoe)
core_reaper / Reaper 7310.0 1.8 1366 440.0 103.0(92 aoe)
arm_decoy_commander 3000.0 1.2 914 200 70.6
core_decoy_commander 3000.0 1.07 906 260 80.0
-------------- fast lev1 attack units
NAME HP SPD WCOST RANGE DPS
core_instigator / Instigator 808.0 2.05 143 220.0 44.0
arm_flash / Flash 771.0 2.35 137 180.0 60.0
core_ak / A.K. 666.0 1.8 106 230.0 41.0
arm_peewee / Peewee 630.0 1.9 104 195.0 60.0
arm_jeffy / Jeffy 615.0 4.0 139 160.0 46.24277456647399
core_weasel / Weasel 660.0 3.724 143 160.0 46.24277456647399
-------------- fast attack/harass units
NAME HP SPD WCOST RANGE DPS
arm_zipper / Zipper 700.0 3.795 210 315.0 31.25
core_freaker / Freaker 745.0 3.7452 222 315.0 25.0
arm_flea / Mouse 750.0 6.0 392 350.0 71.25
arm_tornado / Tornado 500.0 5.56 239 380.0 55.833333333333336
core_voodoo / Voodoo 550.0 5.58 237 400.0 42.0
arm_brawler / Brawler 1501.0 5.1 558.0 450.0 84.44444444444444
core_rapier / Rapier 1569.0 6.1 522 450.0 71.66666666666667
-------------- morty vs fido
NAME HP SPD WCOST RANGE DPS
core_morty / Morty 1254.0 1.37 602 875.0 58
arm_fido / Fido 1440.0 2.0 457 770.0 51.92307692307692
-------------- ballistic artillery units
NAME HP SPD WCOST RANGE DPS
arm_raven / Raven 1500.0 1.9 2255 1400.0 266.6666666666667(80 aoe per rocket)
arm_luger / Luger 1020.0 1.2 1199 1240.0 178.0(64 aoe)
core_mobile_artillery / ... 2413.0 1.0 2213 1240.0 140.0900900900901(144 aoe)
-------------- direct fire artillery units
NAME HP SPD WCOST RANGE DPS
arm_penetrator / Penetrator 2320.0 1.0 1930 1000.0 400.0
arm_shooter / Sniper 1190.0 1.1 1180 1100.0 161.42857142857142
(penetrator seems way less effective in-game than numbers indicate, hmm.....i'd swear it does 200dps and not 400)
-------------- some heavy rocket units
NAME HP SPD WCOST RANGE DPS
core_dominator / Dominator 880.0 1.25 761 1200.0 45.875 (120 aoe)
core_diplomat / Diplomat 850.0 1.1 781 1300.0 47.38461538461539(108 aoe)
arm_merl / Merl 770.0 1.2 762 1300.0 55.083333333333336(96 aoe)
core_nixer / Nixer 765.0 2.1 748 1300.0 62.888888888888886(80 aoe)
arm_wombat / Wombat 750.0 2.1 754 1300.0 65.25(80 aoe)
-------------- kamikaze subs vs inv/roach kamikaze death
core_roach / Roach 195.0 2.0 156 2500(556 aoe) 800(556 aoe)
arm_invader / Invader 185.0 2.1 152 2500(556 aoe) 800(556 aoe)
ARM_hammerhead / Hammerhead 132.0 4.0 173 2500(300 aoe) 2500(300 aoe)
CORE_Barracuda / Barracuda 146.0 4.0 161 2500(300 aoe) 2500(300 aoe)
name hp wCost energy energy/wCost
-------------- energy sources
core_tidal_generator 203.0 115.2 15-25 0.13-0.21
arm_wind_generator 176.0 60 1-30 0.016-0.5
solar_collector 480 141 20 0.1418
core_light_fusion 2500 1820 300 0.1648
arm_mobile_fusion 2100.0 1629 260 0.1596
core_cloackable_fusion_reactor 3260 4088 800 0.1956
core_fusion_power_plant 4000.0 11676 3500 0.3
zeus and cans still seem like moderately effective situation-specific units and are overshadowed by units that have either more important strengths or are more broadly effective.
The energy-to-cost ratio of fusions should be a bit improved, it seems more useful to progressively grow eco with low-cost generators(especially with good wind/tidal strength) than to jump to intermediate fusions. Unless, of course, you are low on space.
Kamikaze subs seem too strong for a level 1 unit.
btw, should we be spamming decoy commanders? They seem pretty good (besides tanking and spotting they can repair fast and build stuffs)
There's other unit stat related stuff i've read on other recent threads. there's one about the least used units.
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 11 Apr 2010, 21:20
by babbles
Why go sub pen at all if kamis are piles of crap? At the moment you can make subs anyway, and without ships they're pretty bad. Minelayers? Scouts are spammed they're largely inefficent. Underwater base? Woo cool, oh, we have no combat units realsitically. Damn.
If you can spam tidal then it's most likely a sea map....so yeah? What's the problem?
Also, it's vastly inefficent to spam simply solars and then go straight to Heavy Fusion. How are you gonna get that 10k metal whatever it is whilst fighting the enemy? Espcially if you've spent it all in solars.
Cans/Zeus. Seriously man. What do you want? They're heavily armoured close range Kbots. Zeus cost less than a Warrior, in every respect. Warriors may be useful for microing but if the enemy has a Doomsday and viper, I'd rather send 5ks metal worth of Zeus at it then Warrior.
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 18 Apr 2010, 22:11
by raaar
Well, if anyone is interested in comparing stats and wants more detailed info about unit weapons than the one present at
http://modinfo.adune.nl/index.php?MOD=xtapev955
EDIT2: nvm, that site has all the info, i just hadn't found it, dah.
check the html file generated by my patented ta-analyzer application (ignore the eval field, i'm having trouble calibrating that thing :/)
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=EY4JL3Q0
NOTE: can't attach files to forum posts, i got "The upload was rejected because the uploaded file was identified as a possible attack vector."
edit, btw:
Why go sub pen at all if kamis are piles of crap? At the moment you can make subs anyway, and without ships they're pretty bad. Minelayers? Scouts are spammed they're largely inefficent. Underwater base? Woo cool, oh, we have no combat units realsitically. Damn.
maybe the strong point of going sub pen should be changed from kamis to amphib combat units instead?
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 18 Apr 2010, 23:42
by knorke
kamikaze subs are cool to blow up hovers
boom boom boom
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 19 Apr 2010, 08:06
by manolo_
knorke wrote:kamikaze subs are cool to blow up hovers
boom boom boom
will they explode automatically or do u have to press ctrl+d?
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 19 Apr 2010, 13:03
by Spawn_Retard
manolo_ wrote:knorke wrote:kamikaze subs are cool to blow up hovers
boom boom boom
will they explode automatically or do u have to press ctrl+d?
obviously self d nub, go play more xta
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 19 Apr 2010, 17:36
by manolo_
Spawn_Retard wrote:manolo_ wrote:knorke wrote:kamikaze subs are cool to blow up hovers
boom boom boom
will they explode automatically or do u have to press ctrl+d?
obviously self d nub, go play more xta
as u may know (and i told you tons of times), im atmo unable to play (newb)
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 20 Apr 2010, 12:48
by 1v0ry_k1ng
raaar, alot of dudes have already gone over those stats. the units are the way they are because they have been tweaked for about 5 years until nothing seems out of place.
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 22 Apr 2010, 22:38
by TheMightyOne
1v0ry_k1ng wrote:the units are the way they are because they have been tweaked for about 5 years until nothing seems out of place.
wise words
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 06 May 2010, 05:33
by mongus
TheMightyOne wrote:1v0ry_k1ng wrote:the units are the way they are because they have been tweaked for about 5 years until nothing seems out of place.
wise words
lies.
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 07 May 2010, 19:16
by 1v0ry_k1ng
mongus wrote:TheMightyOne wrote:1v0ry_k1ng wrote:the units are the way they are because they have been tweaked for about 5 years until nothing seems out of place.
wise words
lies.
ok, with the exeption of sea, which was terrible forever and was then modded to be very slightly less terrible
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 07 May 2010, 19:31
by babbles
OLD SEA WAS PRO
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 08 May 2010, 12:43
by 1v0ry_k1ng
lul
Re: Xta unit stats and balance tweaks (input for next version)
Posted: 09 May 2010, 12:27
by raaar
What is the problem with xtaids units?