Spring RTS Engine

Wasn't it more like, between stumpy and panther.. instead of between bulldog, and panther?

Was built in the lvl-1 lab if I remember right.

As far as Anti-spam was concerned for Core, it was always the Immolator tower from Core Contingency that springs to mind, much more so than the leveler ever was against LVL-1 Flash and unit spam.

Immolator got wierded out in XTA, as a Long range punisher instead of being what it was in CC, which was a LLT ranged tower that was cheap, but worked great against flash rushes.

Nah, mumbo was built in L2 ARM lab, shodan was in arm's L1 Lab, core's too (not sure about it being in core's too actually)

didn't core have something like a mumbo to? or was it just the reaper that shot fire?

edit: I think it might've been this baby: http://www.unituniverse.com/?p=u&v=2332

Na, core didn't have a mumbo equalivent.

And yes- you are correct : reapers used to be "heavy flamethrower tanks" that sucked.

no they did have the rattlesnake
from an old aa changelog:
- Lag-inducing weapons improved (rattlesnake rapid laser, etc)

Well, my memory doesn't serve me very well at the moment =P.

List of units that got removed off the top of my head :

Mumbo / Rattlesnake.
Helios carpet bomber (CORE).
Shodan Mobile LLT.
Demolisher heavy lightning tank (ARM) (Okay, so it sucked - but with a little fixing it coulda been another possible unit to use, the 45 degree-fire arc only was probably it's biggest let down).

hhmm what else, err

-blackdawns
-orcones
-krogtaars
-all mobile bbs
-all bombardment ships
-mobile tacnuke
-cloaking sumo( if you count that as a different unit I guess)
-those lvl1 miniguardian thingies (radical and blocker)
-arm jamming vehicle & core radar vehicle
-core jamming bot & arm radar bot
-Ticks!

Machiosabre wrote:hhmm what else, err

-blackdawns
-orcones
-krogtaars
-all mobile bbs
-mobile tacnuke
-cloaking sumo( if you count that as a different unit I guess)
-those lvl1 miniguardian thingies (radical and blocker)
-arm jamming vehicle & core radar vehicle
-core jamming bot & arm radar bot
-Ticks!

I think we'd all like to see that stuff back, at least in some mod (if not BA) since AA got popular originaly as basically "a well-balanced TAUIP" - more is better, as long as the units are well-defined.

Mobile LLTs would help end the irritating LLT-build-war in commrushing.

I'd bring back the Arm heavy lightning tank (Devestator, was it?) as a nice unit to fill the space between the Penetrator and the Bulldog - a slow, heavy-combat unit designed for firing at individual superheavy targets (where the Bulldog's cannon has a blast radius that makes it better for crowd settings, and is fast enough for assault purposes). Basically an Arm light-Sumo-tank.

Cloaking Sumo was silly, though.

And yeah, I liked the miniguardians - I'd bring them back as low-trajectory-only antinaval cannons and remove the antinaval features from the Guardian.

And the mobile-tacnuke's problem was that it just wasn't worth building. It was a fun unit if you could get it.

The Mumbo never really had a well-defined role... players used it for anti-swarm, but the key features for anti-swarm are large blast-radius and high impact - the Bulldog does better antiswarm than the Mumbo. Bringing it back would be fun if a role could be found for it.... one thing is that it really looks more like a Core unit than an Arm one. Perhaps make the Reaper into a superheavy Leveller (slow, mega-riot-cannon, etc), and thus Core gets an answer to the Mav's L1-spam-raping-abilities, and then use the Mumbo to fill the Reaper's old shoes.

the mumbo was good antiswarm defense because it had a high rof, thats really what lvl2 vehcs don't have, you could say that something like fatboys and gollies are good vs lots of small units, and they are, but in between the shots they'll still keep coming so they suck as an actual defense against small units.

plus it was sorta cheap if I remember correctly, so you didn't have to shell out close to 1000 metal for a decent lvl2 vehicle.

Saktoth wrote:Yeah the seaplane swarmer hasnt been fixed yet, it needs to get the same treatement the other fighters got.

On the topic of broken planes. The Torpedo Seaplane still has noautofire=1. Most bombers have this (I guess so they dont fly up in the air and start bombing just anything?), but regular torpedo bombers do not have it, and nor should torpedo seaplanes. On top of this, it means the Torpedo Seaplane wont fire its AA missile either (I dont think most people even know it has one!).

On the topic of nobody knowing something has AA missiles, the Pheonix Arm heavy bomber. You know that little gun on top of its head? Its not useless- its an AA missile. But because it has noautofire=1, it never fires unless you specifically tell it to target a plane (And who uses bombers to attack planes anyway?). So best take noautofire off the Pheonix too, or remove its AA missile. Or something.

quoting for importance

btw didn't the phoenix have a urine-yellow laser in OTA that shot really fast but did less dmg than LLT?

IMO, Sumo would have been fine as a Stealth Unit (NOT CLOAKED) but radar invisible to improve its survivability vs long range heavy weapons.

I gotta agree that I miss almost everyone of those units, they all filled a niche and best part, they made no other units redundant, they were unique.

But back then, Kbots and Gantries were common, less nowadays it seems as everyone whores Vehicles regardless of map terrain.

MR.D wrote:But back then, Kbots and Gantries were common, less nowadays it seems as everyone whores Vehicles regardless of map terrain.

This is true because artillery is so much better than anything kbots have, although they're somewhat equal at T1 if there is some height.

naw, vehicles eat Kbots for breakfast, then they laugh at the Kbots hiding in the hills and rush your commander and eat him too ^^

Not at all. While there is no substitute for l2 vehicles in assault, once the maps bogged down and the clear routes are blocked by defences k-bots come into their own.

if you have rockos and somebodies trying to kill your HLT with arty.. its not that hard to kill those arties :3

Foxomaniac wrote:Me and Tired extensively tested skeeters against other sea units, they WERE OP.

3 Skeets (costing 300 metal, less time to build + faster speed + "fast unit miss factor" bonus + effective combined DPS of about 190ish + Anti air missile + ability to attack while corvette is still being built =P) vs 1 Corvette (effective combined DPS of 120 + both guns do NOT always attack the same unit, so the DPS can gets split up), winner = skeets.

Skeets beat other naval units semi-cost for cost (most of the time for less) + all those other bonuses.

The only way to deal with skeets was with torpedos from subs - which the skeets can simply outrun the sub or static defense, which is very costly in sea, even then - with enough skeets static defense becomes useless.

Verdict?

Wezel of the sea!

Please try to beat me sometime by just spamming skeeters...

tombom wrote:

MR.D wrote:But back then, Kbots and Gantries were common, less nowadays it seems as everyone whores Vehicles regardless of map terrain.

This is true because artillery is so much better than anything kbots have, although they're somewhat equal at T1 if there is some height.

Especially once this bugfix gets implemented (Thanks to Kloot for fixing it!): http://spring.clan-sy.com/mantis/view.php?id=363

Minor bug found, Dragon's Claw [armclaw] has no yard map, should be "ffff" just like Dragon's Teeth [armdrag].

why can the advanced fusion only be built be adv. con vehicles? that makes no sense imo.

silp wrote:why can the advanced fusion only be built be adv. con vehicles? that makes no sense imo.

Basically, AA had the T2 kbot build the T3 gantry, the T2 vehicle build the advanced fusion plant, and the T2 air construction unit build the seaplane plant. This way each of the three land tech trees got a different ultimate item to diversify them more. I can't speak to whether or not this is a good idea since it doesn't really bother me either way.