[old] Balanced Annihilation V6.81

[ginekolog]

yep, zeus are a bit too good.
Shiva is fine, its T3 ffs.
Marauder is sux, needs more health and maybe dps.
Antis are fine, there must be a way to end games ( and bombers and nukes does it well, we hate endelss porcfests)

Others suff Fat allready has coverd.

[BaNa]

I like the current levelers. Don't turn them into some slow stumpy-clone.

You shouldn't let torp bombers close to your com. The thing to fix here is that the torps home in on cloaked units. IMO they should approximate the place where the com is and explode randomly in a fairly large radius around it.

One of the problems with having your com in the water is that you cant jam sonar so the enemy is sure to spot it. A solution to this would be either to have the jammer ship jam sonar too or change sonar so it only returns blips. I dont know how feasible these are. Pelican is silly. Even the name is silly, it's like calling a tank the cow. The unit should be replaced by something less laughable.

To the whole kbot-vech thing : if rezzers could build mexes then the expansion wouldnt be slower. I actually dont have anything against the ca-style longer ranged hammers, that could work well.

[TheFatController]

I actually dont have anything against the ca-style longer ranged hammers, that could work well.

As I remember these underwent many changes due to being OP (skirmishing artillery at t1..) it's not something you really want just Arm to have either.

[Pxtl]

If BA got long-ranged hammers, you'd obviously have to nerf their speed so they wouldn't just be skirmishing arty. Also, I'd want Core to get the Immolator brought back as a static version of same, with the appropriate buff or price-cut to compensate for being static.

I mean, better differentiation between Hammers and Warriors would be *nice*, and making hammers into an arty/fire-support unit would be a good way to do it... but not worth the risk of breaking the balance.

[TradeMark]

core needs zipper equivalent... or nerf zipper speed, since flamer isnt even near as good as zippers are

[Pxtl]

core needs zipper equivalent... or nerf zipper speed, since flamer isnt even near as good as zippers are

Zippers sucked for a very, very, very long time. They finally got it right again. Don't diss the Zipper. The Pyro is a different role, yes - more like the Panther than the Zipper.

[TradeMark]

yeah thats what i mean, core doesnt have zipper role unit >_>

[Pxtl]

yeah thats what i mean, core doesnt have zipper role unit >_>

Arm != Core. The fact that Arm has a unit that Core lacks is no reason to bring out the nerf-stick.

Arm doesn't have a Dominator - their L2 artillery kbot cloaks. Or a cloakable crawling nuke. Or a flying battlestation - they have a nuclear bomber instead. Or a non-cloakable L1 jammer - theirs cloaks. Or a stun-gunship - their L1 gunship does damage instead. Or a self-pwning anti-swarm L1 tank - the Arm counterpart is faster-moving and a squad of them can take out a Comm in a single volley.... or....

wait, Core just sucks.

(kidding).

[BaNa]

also, zippers are only truly op on maps that they have 160% speedboost. They should not be balanced for such maps.

[TheFatController]

also, zippers are only truly op on maps that they have 160% speedboost. They should not be balanced for such maps.

This is the most important thing to remember.

[Pxtl]

Wait, you mean his damned speedball maps also have that silly SpeedMetal speedboost? I figured he'd have the good sense to cut that out at least.

Well, another reason I'm happy to have never played them.

[BaNa]

Wait, you mean his damned speedball maps also have that silly SpeedMetal speedboost? I figured he'd have the good sense to cut that out at least.

Well, another reason I'm happy to have never played them.

neurope mearth and dworld...

[Pxtl]

Wait, the "roads" on Beherith's maps are that strong? Seriously?

[BaNa]

Wait, the "roads" on Beherith's maps are that strong? Seriously?

did you think it was all the amphetamines that made the units so zippy?

[Pxtl]

I generally go straight for the water on those maps, so I hadn't noticed how strong the effect was.

I also don't tend to live very long. FFA is where I try experiments that will problably fail, like comnap-training.

[TradeMark]

yeah thats what i mean, core doesnt have zipper role unit >_>

Arm != Core. The fact that Arm has a unit that Core lacks is no reason to bring out the nerf-stick.

Arm doesn't have a Dominator - their L2 artillery kbot cloaks. Or a cloakable crawling nuke. Or a flying battlestation - they have a nuclear bomber instead. Or a non-cloakable L1 jammer - theirs cloaks. Or a stun-gunship - their L1 gunship does damage instead. Or a self-pwning anti-swarm L1 tank - the Arm counterpart is faster-moving and a squad of them can take out a Comm in a single volley.... or....

wait, Core just sucks.

(kidding).

so what... zipper is mostly game ending unit

ive fucked up enemies many times with zippers in greenfields... and it has no speed boost >_>

[jellyman]

Units that I don't think I've ever seen used with a positive result on the battlefield

Pelican
Gimp
Halberd
Tremor
Fatboy

The next list is units I have occasionally seen have a positive result on the battlefiedl. However I think that other units may have done better, and that the positive use of these units had more to do with an economic advantage, or poor play by opponents.

Fido
Hammer
Thud
Warrior
Can
Pyro
Annihalator
Doomsday
Ambusher
Toaster
Guardian
Punisher
Vulcan
Arm version Vulcan


Units which often do well, but I still think are an inferior choice in all but most but maybe not all circumstances:
leveler
janus (Leveler seem to be far more popular than janus)
Sumo
Goliath
Bulldog (only because of stumpy)
Reaper (only because of raider)
Big Bertha
Intimidator
T3
Keeper
Deflector
Annihilator
Light amphibious tanks
Any anti air other than missile towers
banshee
Brawler
Rapier
Blackdawn
Liche
Shadow
Thunder
Maverick (personal opinion overpowered against t1 spam, and underpowered against everything else)

There are very few units I consider very powerful.

con vehicles - High ch hp and reclaim speed. Con vehicles reclaiming in the middle of a fight can be a huge problem for a kbot player late t1, as the kbot player can only reclaim clear of the battle. I think kbots need a buff somewhere to compensate.
T2 fighters - seems to make any other form of AA redundant. Extremely difficult to penetrate a fighter screen. Also when landed, they generate about the same amount of energy per metal spent as advanced solars. It may be just viable to use these as an economy in greenfields, although I suspect the build time cost would be too high.
Stumpy - when masses seem extremelly difficult for kbot player to counter. I think a nerf is in order.
Rocko/Storm - My bread and butter unit. In the first few minutes I would back these units to beat any other t1 unit in the game (although very early they are vulnerable to ak/peewee). However later on massed stumpies turn the table decisively. Not sure if slashers/samsons are good counter to this unit, I've never had a problem with this myself, but I don't think I've fought someone who has been serious about spamming this unit, possibly because it would make them too weak against my tank allies (I play team games). This unit does feel overpowered to me. But the relatively low frequency of its use, and its weakness further into the game suggest it does not need a nerf or counter.

[el_matarife]

Wait, the "roads" on Beherith's maps are that strong? Seriously?

Just build minelayers and lay tons of light mines on the roads. Roads are great for mining since the pathfinding system will take them automatically no matter what.

[BaNa]

Gimp

Gimps used to be mega op versus everything, but with the nerf they seem to fail quite hard in the water. Not sure how they do on land now.

All in all, it would be nice to have more amphibious units that shoot torps. Theres only the gimp now. Maybe add some mega-torps to the shivas of this world?

[Beherith]

Gimps need a turret turn rate boost to become more viable. Also, their previous torp weapon was much more useful, now they have a very hard time killing underwater fusions, even in large numbers.