EE version 0.173 Final (no more stuffs)
Moderator: Moderators
Commandfire only works when attacking ground, read the wiki (I updated it).
What you probably want is noautofire=1; in the fbi. This wont stop them behaving stupid, but at least it will stop them behaving stupid unless you tell them to attack.
Its really just a problem with stockpiled weapons on mobile units. When they have 0 ammo, they read that as not having a shot, so they move closer... this is fine for stationary weapons cuz they dont move.
Another alternative might be to give them a false weapon1 with the same range as their regular weapon, that isnt a stockpile weapon. Make it so that it never fires and doesnt do any damage, but gives the tank that 'Okay, im in range and firing! I dont need to move anywhere.' feeling.
What you probably want is noautofire=1; in the fbi. This wont stop them behaving stupid, but at least it will stop them behaving stupid unless you tell them to attack.
Its really just a problem with stockpiled weapons on mobile units. When they have 0 ammo, they read that as not having a shot, so they move closer... this is fine for stationary weapons cuz they dont move.
Another alternative might be to give them a false weapon1 with the same range as their regular weapon, that isnt a stockpile weapon. Make it so that it never fires and doesnt do any damage, but gives the tank that 'Okay, im in range and firing! I dont need to move anywhere.' feeling.
Just for you Forb, i have uploaded this video of Firecrack getting beaten by my superior missile bots which take no micro at all to use.
http://download.yousendit.com/90C959AE0CE4FF72
I will give in and admit that i won this game because of my greater economy, still missile bots are better than they were a few versions ago, back then they would not even be able to touch a line of cannon tanks, now, they are able to devastate them.
Edit: Your artificial tests dont take into account the greater cost of GD tanks.
http://download.yousendit.com/90C959AE0CE4FF72
I will give in and admit that i won this game because of my greater economy, still missile bots are better than they were a few versions ago, back then they would not even be able to touch a line of cannon tanks, now, they are able to devastate them.
Edit: Your artificial tests dont take into account the greater cost of GD tanks.
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Forboding Angel
- Evolution RTS Developer
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- Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43
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Forboding Angel
- Evolution RTS Developer
- Posts: 14673
- Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43
Ungh
You both fail so damn hard.
First of all, your rocket bots were getting pwned in relation. He had nothing, but managed to kill quite a few rocket bots with all of about 4 cannon tanks.
Here is where he fails. He build nothing but cannon tanks and IONs on a heavily wooded map. That's just dumb.
You fail because you didn't watch your own replay. The guy had all of 4 tanks at one time, how the hell are the rocket bots OP when there are 6 - 10 on 4? In relation, your rocket bots got pwned.
Hell, my tests showed more conclusion than this game did. I'm not even gonna bother posting the screenies I took cause it's just a waste of time.
BTW you both PHAIL for playing EE on Small Divide. Who the hell thought that was a good idea?
BTW, both of your build orders fail hardcore. His was better than yours, but just barely. Nothing but cannons on a heavily wooded map
It's not even funny. I wish I could watch this game and laugh, but unfortunately it fails so hard I can't do anything except roll my eyes. Especially after you coming in here making wild eyed claims about something being overpowered, me taking a goodly bit of time to make sure that that is not the case, and then you post this replay which is utter fail.
Arugh! Next time you have something to report as being OP or UP at least take the time to properly test it first. Many of us (fang, deci, me, lathan, misc others) pay very close attention to the numbers in EE, and we have spent VERY careful time balancing GD vs URC as was intended via original design that got a little muddy in .171.
After .171 I launched a campaign of beta testing that went on damn near every night for prolly over 3 or 4 weeks. URC stuff wasn't touched at all. URC is pretty much perfectly balanced vs GD, and vice versa. Obviously, there are a few things I and others are keeping our eyes on (lv3 shottie mech comes to mind) to see if specific units/weapons are or are not overpowered/underpowered.
Please, just be more careful in the future. It's a little frustrating, because I put a lot of time into testing every scenario I could possibly think of to see if rocket bots were OP, and my conclusion was that if anything, the GD missle tank was UNDERpowered(which I don't really think it is TBH). I'm not saying that you aren't a credible source andreask, quite the opposite. The fact that I consider you a credible source is why I spent so much time checking out your claim.
In the future, please just post the replays so that we can look, and if something is OP or UP in EE, generally it's blaringly obvious (not all the time though, there have been a few sleepers here and there). Also, please do us the favor of watching the replay(s) of said game(s), to make sure that you aren't accidentally making a false claim.
meh. Anyway, thanks for posting the replay.
You both fail so damn hard.
First of all, your rocket bots were getting pwned in relation. He had nothing, but managed to kill quite a few rocket bots with all of about 4 cannon tanks.
Here is where he fails. He build nothing but cannon tanks and IONs on a heavily wooded map. That's just dumb.
You fail because you didn't watch your own replay. The guy had all of 4 tanks at one time, how the hell are the rocket bots OP when there are 6 - 10 on 4? In relation, your rocket bots got pwned.
Hell, my tests showed more conclusion than this game did. I'm not even gonna bother posting the screenies I took cause it's just a waste of time.
BTW you both PHAIL for playing EE on Small Divide. Who the hell thought that was a good idea?
BTW, both of your build orders fail hardcore. His was better than yours, but just barely. Nothing but cannons on a heavily wooded map
It's not even funny. I wish I could watch this game and laugh, but unfortunately it fails so hard I can't do anything except roll my eyes. Especially after you coming in here making wild eyed claims about something being overpowered, me taking a goodly bit of time to make sure that that is not the case, and then you post this replay which is utter fail.
Arugh! Next time you have something to report as being OP or UP at least take the time to properly test it first. Many of us (fang, deci, me, lathan, misc others) pay very close attention to the numbers in EE, and we have spent VERY careful time balancing GD vs URC as was intended via original design that got a little muddy in .171.
After .171 I launched a campaign of beta testing that went on damn near every night for prolly over 3 or 4 weeks. URC stuff wasn't touched at all. URC is pretty much perfectly balanced vs GD, and vice versa. Obviously, there are a few things I and others are keeping our eyes on (lv3 shottie mech comes to mind) to see if specific units/weapons are or are not overpowered/underpowered.
Please, just be more careful in the future. It's a little frustrating, because I put a lot of time into testing every scenario I could possibly think of to see if rocket bots were OP, and my conclusion was that if anything, the GD missle tank was UNDERpowered(which I don't really think it is TBH). I'm not saying that you aren't a credible source andreask, quite the opposite. The fact that I consider you a credible source is why I spent so much time checking out your claim.
In the future, please just post the replays so that we can look, and if something is OP or UP in EE, generally it's blaringly obvious (not all the time though, there have been a few sleepers here and there). Also, please do us the favor of watching the replay(s) of said game(s), to make sure that you aren't accidentally making a false claim.
meh. Anyway, thanks for posting the replay.
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Forboding Angel
- Evolution RTS Developer
- Posts: 14673
- Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43
wheeee triple post
The tanks cost all of about 20 metal more. The margin is very small. URC lv1 bots build about 2-3 seconds faster than a tank. The cost is pretty much an even split.
Devastated a line of cannon tanks??? He had 34 assorted vladost and vladost IIC(radar tank), all lv1. You had 45 rocket mechs. 1 lv3, about 4-6 medium rocket mechs, and all the rest were lv1. You lost all of your rocket mechs save 2 medium rocket mechs in that battle. Pound for pound, He kicked your ass!
Any decent GD player would have handed your ass to you on a silver platter.
The tanks cost all of about 20 metal more. The margin is very small. URC lv1 bots build about 2-3 seconds faster than a tank. The cost is pretty much an even split.
Devastated a line of cannon tanks??? He had 34 assorted vladost and vladost IIC(radar tank), all lv1. You had 45 rocket mechs. 1 lv3, about 4-6 medium rocket mechs, and all the rest were lv1. You lost all of your rocket mechs save 2 medium rocket mechs in that battle. Pound for pound, He kicked your ass!
Any decent GD player would have handed your ass to you on a silver platter.
Did we test twenty three versions Forb? I think I spent more time doing that than eating and sleeping combined during those days...
Andreask, I'm going to be a little more tactful. Your economy was the deciding factor, to whit, your post start build order was slightly superior, and your unit selection was better. But when I crunch the meat of the replay and some tests, I have to confirm what Forboding is saying.
Andreask, I'm going to be a little more tactful. Your economy was the deciding factor, to whit, your post start build order was slightly superior, and your unit selection was better. But when I crunch the meat of the replay and some tests, I have to confirm what Forboding is saying.
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1v0ry_k1ng
- Posts: 4656
- Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 10:24
I am not a master of E&E. I play too many mods to be a great player in any of them. However, the optimal start for E&E is actually 2k metal, 2k energy. In that case, I usually pull one land and one air factory, then a repair pad. If I'm URC I might build another land factory, but if I'm GD I generally don't.
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Forboding Angel
- Evolution RTS Developer
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- Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43
Well my latest "masspwn" version was 24. I would be doing internal testing now, but I'm having a real hard time finding anything that isn't right. .173 is imo the most perfected version that has been released so far.
Next version will have the newly textured units, with I think very little changes regarding GD/URC.
Starting BO for urc
1 mex
1 power
1 hub - Build land factory as soon as possible
mex
mex
power
mex
mex
air factory +repair pad, start building interceptors and ground attacks
BO for GD
mex
mex
mex (You need the energy from 3 mexes so you won't stall)
hub - land fact
mex
mex
Air fact
Then build a reactor as soon as you can.
These BO's are pretty basic, but in general most players use slight variations of these.
Next version will have the newly textured units, with I think very little changes regarding GD/URC.
Starting BO for urc
1 mex
1 power
1 hub - Build land factory as soon as possible
mex
mex
power
mex
mex
air factory +repair pad, start building interceptors and ground attacks
BO for GD
mex
mex
mex (You need the energy from 3 mexes so you won't stall)
hub - land fact
mex
mex
Air fact
Then build a reactor as soon as you can.
These BO's are pretty basic, but in general most players use slight variations of these.
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Guessmyname
- Posts: 3301
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1v0ry_k1ng
- Posts: 4656
- Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 10:24
That ingame picture is the URC aircraft carrier right? Maybe it should have some lines or something on the flightdeck because it looks like armor plates and not something to land an aircraft on.
Zoombie:
The picture with the lasertanks is just supposed to look good, ie if new players read the thread.
Oh, and you did confuse units. Remember the 3 FFA on this map with the roads? you built anti air planes but wanted the groundattack stuff. (you also started with 4x reactor or something
)
something for the EE guide in the wiki:
This is from a real game and not faked and it happens quite often
Zoombie:
The picture with the lasertanks is just supposed to look good, ie if new players read the thread.
Oh, and you did confuse units. Remember the 3 FFA on this map with the roads? you built anti air planes but wanted the groundattack stuff. (you also started with 4x reactor or something
)something for the EE guide in the wiki:
This is from a real game and not faked and it happens quite often
God I hate it when people think hubs are good nanotowers.. such retardation..
As far as EE building set up..
URC needs about 3 mexs and 2 reactors by the time its first mech factory is down to not stall hard
GD needs still roughly 3 mexs and soon after a reactor to not stall hard
EE runs on a semi blocked system of resource use, the lvl 1 URC factory drains roughly 15-16 m per sec when constantly operating, and the GD about 14.. This means you need roughly 16 metal income to run one factory for either side, artillery units being produced may skew this slightly.. So basically as far as factory duplication at 30 metal income you should slap down a second factory on constant production, and so forth.. It is likely after your second lvl 1 factory that once you achieve some overflow, or have reached potential that you begin teching to tier 2..
Side notes that the lvl 1 shipyard uses roughly the same resource drain as lvl 1 factory per side.. The aircraft factories will use more, however they will likely not be in constant production, and a note that scout aircraft cost as much as scout vehicles and so drain very little..
As far as EE building set up..
URC needs about 3 mexs and 2 reactors by the time its first mech factory is down to not stall hard
GD needs still roughly 3 mexs and soon after a reactor to not stall hard
EE runs on a semi blocked system of resource use, the lvl 1 URC factory drains roughly 15-16 m per sec when constantly operating, and the GD about 14.. This means you need roughly 16 metal income to run one factory for either side, artillery units being produced may skew this slightly.. So basically as far as factory duplication at 30 metal income you should slap down a second factory on constant production, and so forth.. It is likely after your second lvl 1 factory that once you achieve some overflow, or have reached potential that you begin teching to tier 2..
Side notes that the lvl 1 shipyard uses roughly the same resource drain as lvl 1 factory per side.. The aircraft factories will use more, however they will likely not be in constant production, and a note that scout aircraft cost as much as scout vehicles and so drain very little..
