Expand and Exterminate version 0.163 Released

[KlavoHunter]

If you decreased the metal cost of the bigger factories, and then only increased the buildtime of the units inside, I think that would be good.

[Torrasque]

I like the idea too.

I don't know if it's possible, but you can try to make the unit go out of the factory a bit slower, so you can't start building an another directly.
Like that, even with mass constructor, like that there will be at least 3 second between 2 units.
So if you really want a lot, you'll have to build more factories, Helping with 3-4 constructor will still help you. (but 25 don't)

[FizWizz]

I'm interested in the idea of lowering factory costs. It is just an opinion of mine, but I always thought it to be better (for mods in general) for players to build multiple factories to increase production rather than ring a factory with assisting con units. Just my two cents.

[Drone_Fragger]

I still think Moho costs should be halved and Impulses reduced. The huge impulses cause games to desync

[Aun]

I still think Moho costs should be halved and Impulses reduced. The huge impulses cause games to desync

What huge impulses? Even GD artillery doesn't have that high an impulse...

[krogothe]

oh boy they do! mortar bots/turrets/tanks on a low gravity maps can own dozens of lvl1s with a couple shots, they fly into each other for huge damage

[Decimator]

Key phrase:

low gravity maps

And in any case, we didn't have sync error problems when the impulse mines were in use...

[Zpock]

Maybe remove mohos all together and increase normal metal extractors output.

[Aun]

Maybe remove mohos all together and increase normal metal extractors output.

And make early game a complete spamfest.

[Zpock]

Maybe remove mohos all together and increase normal metal extractors output.

And make early game a complete spamfest.

Nah, why u think that? It will just make resource growth nice and linear and eliminate all sitting and exponentially growing your econ.

[Fanger]

Well anywho my comment about the factories has to do with the fact that I never see URC players making use of the stealth units at lvl 2.. my thought is that lvl 2 is too difficult to get to, or that the stealth units are to difficult to get to.. one or the other..

[Drone_Fragger]

I think thats because level 2 and 3 cost so much, You can only afford *some* units. I choose the Normal ones because they last longer, and do more damage/cost. also, The decloak range si so huge, they tend to decloak rather easily.
But thats my opinion.

[Neddie]

As for the Moho change... I don't think it's a good idea. My personal issue with the economy is very different, though I probably shouldn't broach it until I have more replays to show it. It comes back to some fairly early economic decisions, but not, thank all, the lack of metal makers, which I still support. And, by "still support"... make myself perfectly clear. I don't want them in E&E. At all.

Hopefully nobody will misread my meaning now.

I too play URC pretty exclusively and see little reason to go for Stealth, though I have pulled off some nice tricks in one game with a fairly large stealth force. Generally, however, the decloak is prohibitive... as it should be!

[Zpock]

Moho metal extractors and metal makers are pretty much the same thing, only that the extractors are more limited in how many you can make until you run out of patches. This is especially true since the mohos in EE take 1k energy each heh. They let you invest resources into getting more resources, while not as obscene as the metal makers, they still extend the boring building up resources stage a lot. If you remove mohos, increase normal mines to extract something in between a normal metal extractor and a moho, then you would just grab the metal patches and get on with the war. Expanding and exterminating instead of building stuff in your base. Then lower cost of factories so their cheap, maybe 300-600-1200 metal each for lvl 1-2-3. Then game flow will get much faster and better.

[Neddie]

Guys, I'm too sick to play right now, but I think I'll add a King of E&E title to the wiki. It had to happen eventually, and it might spark interest in both the mods and 1v1s.

[Aun]

Moho metal extractors and metal makers are pretty much the same thing, only that the extractors are more limited in how many you can make until you run out of patches. This is especially true since the mohos in EE take 1k energy each heh. They let you invest resources into getting more resources, while not as obscene as the metal makers, they still extend the boring building up resources stage a lot. If you remove mohos, increase normal mines to extract something in between a normal metal extractor and a moho, then you would just grab the metal patches and get on with the war. Expanding and exterminating instead of building stuff in your base. Then lower cost of factories so their cheap, maybe 300-600-1200 metal each for lvl 1-2-3. Then game flow will get much faster and better.

But then you expand, find the other player... and hit a deadlock... I still higher output lvl1 mexes are a bad idea - teaching early and upgrading your mexes is a strategy! Factory costs that low would just encourage obscenely fast teching, plus the air rushes!

P.S. Moho mexes use 500 energy to run...

[Neddie]

Okay, it isn't very pretty or well-written, but I put it up.

http://taspring.clan-sy.com/wiki/King_of_EE

Go, and become a King somehow...

[Forboding Angel]

Ok to dispell a lot of stuff that is jsut wrong...

medium/heavy mexes only take 500 energy to maintain. There is a good reason for this. That reason is that someone on a lv1 econ can fight someone on a partial lv1/lv2 econ equaly as well as the partial econ guy can... for a little while. Once you get a full lv2 econ up a lv1 econ won't be able to put up near as good of a fight.

I really like it this way, you are not punished for not going lv2 as early and sticking with lv1 units. It is excellent execution of keeping the economic blances even for a while. And btw, the heavy energy plants for URC aren't very expensive at all, and gd's reactors are horrifically cheap, so I don't see how this would cause anyone a problem.

Fang: The reason I don't use the stealth units too much is probably the cost, even though at the moment I have no idea what the current cost difference is (could be a placebo effect as well).

[Aun]

Fang: The reason I don't use the stealth units too much is probably the cost, even though at the moment I have no idea what the current cost difference is (could be a placebo effect as well).

I think stealth bots have a bad reputation because people build them and use them like normal attackers, almost always without mobile ECM.

They're perfect for sneaking into the vunerable innards of a base and wreaking havoc on factories, mexes, generators, storage, aa...

The most important thing (after jamming) is to scout ahead with spiders and aircraft so you don't accidentally bump into a defence line.

Oh, remember the ever useful 'Hold fire' and Hold position'.

[Fanger]

I would just like to say that I believe shields will be on hold for some time, currently I believe they use the default dmg of a weapon to determine how much dmg they recieve. This causes a problem for me because I use the default dmg to determine the size of the explosion graphic so the default dmg has little to no correlation to the actual weapons dmg but instead has to do with how big the aoe is. If this is indeed the case which it appears to be then shield cannot be implemented as it would be utterly impossible to balance them against dmg values which are utterly incosistant with the weapon firing them. So unfortunately at this point in time we have a choice of either semi correct sized explosions, or shields..