Balanced Annihilation V6.21

[el_matarife]

A: You posted that in the wrong forum; there's a Mods forum for a reason.

B: Mod-related posts go in that mod's thread, much like the sticky states.

Wow I didn't know you could merge threads, neat. (Even though it does make my two posts look a little weird.)

[Acidd_UK]

Ok, snipers are OP, core riot tanks are UP.

Snipers:

Have way too many HP. They move to fast so if you opponent gets 5 of them they can walk through your line before you can do anything about it (bombers etc). When you get tanks near them, it take sa reaper around 10 shots to kill a single sniper. I suggest their HP is nerfed heavily, os that they are pretty much guaranteed to die if they are 'caught'.

Levellers:

Oh come on this isnt even funny. Arm riot tank kills an llt in ONE SHOT. Core riot tank takes about 6. Add to this the crappy speed, crappy range, and large cost, they really do suck. You never see people building them because they suck. Att he same time the janus is still op because it's missile still seem to track beyond their normal range. Not to mention the mad damage. Not saying their massively OP, but it seems unbalanced compared to cores andto flash spam unit...

Discuss.

[LordMatt]

I am against both changes. IMO leveler is better than janus for the intended role, killing unit spams. Neither is designed for base assault. Snips can be killed with weak unit spams or air (I have personally held off sniper spam with jeffs). Arm needs to maintain a good porc busting kbot.

[Acidd_UK]

This is my problem, the sniper isnt just porc busing, it massacres units as well....

Edit: So the janus is ok in terms of balance against the leveller? Come on, it's clear the janus is miles better than the leveller in every role....

[Jazcash]

Snipers health is amazingly low for T2. Reapers have low damage and high health anyway so don't use them to compare damage and health. Levelers are great and I see people using them all the time, IMO they are much better than Arm tanks.
I think reapers damage needs to be beefed up a little though, They can be easily defeated with one or two T1 tanks easily purely because of the low damage on the reaper. I'd say lower it's health by maybe a 1/4 and up it's damage by 1/2.

[Abaddon]

Levelers have good damage, but too low range and speed. With this speed they are useless vs any longer range units, and low defence makes them useless vs stationary defence.

IMO Core T1 is really UP.

Air - no T1 gunship (bladewings succesful uses are extremelly rare)
K-bots - arm have Warrior similar to T2 Pyros, peewes who have very good damage (much more effective then AK) and FLEA (core have no scout kbot at all)
Vehicles - Flashes are much more effective then Instigators

To make AK's and Instigators usable vs Peewees and Flashes there rate of fire must be doubled.

In fact, core have no chances vs rushing arm. Even Beamer is more effective then HLT - more damege and range.

And one question - why does wind generators, metal makers and nano towers explode so strong?

[KDR_11k]

I think most people would call you insane for saying the 'gator needs a 100% strength increase to be even with the flash.

[Acidd_UK]

I cant tell if he's taking the piss out of me or serious!

[LordMatt]

This is my problem, the sniper isnt just porc busing, it massacres units as well....

Edit: So the janus is ok in terms of balance against the leveller? Come on, it's clear the janus is miles better than the leveller in every role....

I play arm almost exclusively and I'd much rather have the leveler. Like I said, I held off snip spam with only jeffs, so I don't think they're OP. As for Abaddon, play some more games before posting in this thread.

[Abaddon]

Yes, 100% is excess, but ~30% will be good :)

And what about Warrior? Isn't it too powerful for T1?

I have played enough to draw a conclusion. I have 'experienced' rank.

[LordMatt]

Yes, 100% is excess, but ~30% will be good :)

And what about Warrior? Isn't it too powerful for T1?

I have played enough to draw a conclusion. I have 'experienced' rank.

Judging by your comments, no.

[Abaddon]

Ok... What can core oppose to Warriors (from T1)? Only levelers... But levelers are vehicles.

Have you ever seen Instigator spam (i have seen only once)? Instigators formal DPS is similiar to Flash one, but in real battle Flashes much more effective. It 'll be much better to double/triple rate of fire and proportionally decrease damage. Same relative to AK's.

And about bladewings - have uoy ever seen them succesfully used? I'm had never - too low hp, too low power.

P.S.: Sorry if i'm expressing with ambiguity, my english isn't good...

[LordMatt]

If you play more with good players you will see how to counter warriors, use gators properly, and how to use blades.

[kiki]

gators have more range and require more leetness in your micro.

Same with aks, and aks have very good los.

Bladewings are very nice in numbers for experiementals, or to pause an assault so your fleas can kill all those goliaths.

[ginekolog]

The only thing that is perhaps worth changing is all big ships getting really the same movement class.

[smokingwreckage]

I don't know if good players even talk about towers, but the dragon's maw kicks arse against swarm/spam. The ARM lightning thingy is more or less useless.

[Jazcash]

Gators have higher range than flash therefore it'd be more effective to use it's range against the flash. Just keep them at the maximum range so the flash can't shoot the gators but the gators can shoot them. Flash are designed for full in close to close combat, gators aren't designed for that.

And as for warriors which use laser weapons, you will find that the simple red lasers are not very effective against Vehicles, for example a stumpy or two could easily take out a warrior. Also Janus's can be used very effectively against stronger T1.
But I must agree, the Core Thud is no match against an Arm Warrior. I think the Warriors rate of fire or damage needs to be dropped to the same as the thuds.

[Abaddon]

Gators have higher range than flash therefore it'd be more effective to use it's range against the flash. Just keep them at the maximum range so the flash can't shoot the gators but the gators can shoot them. Flash are designed for full in close to close combat, gators aren't designed for that.

One problem - flash is faster and more maneurable, and difference in range is small (230 vs 180) so it isn't possible.

And as for warriors which use laser weapons, you will find that the simple red lasers are not very effective against Vehicles

Only because of Vehicles high HP. They have no damage penaltys.

for example a stumpy or two could easily take out a warrior. Also Janus's can be used very effectively against stronger T1.

Raiders or Levelers can be used, but i told about k-bots.

But I must agree, the Core Thud is no match against an Arm Warrior. I think the Warriors rate of fire or damage needs to be dropped to the same as the thuds.

Thud is analog of Hammer, so it isn't right to compare them.

Bladewings are very nice in numbers for experiementals, or to pause an assault so your fleas can kill all those goliaths.

One mobile AA 'll destroy all of them regardless of quanlity.

If you play more with good players you will see how to counter warriors, use gators properly, and how to use blades.

I have played more then 100 hours with Highly experienced and Veteran ranked players, and have never seen them used blades and have only once seen gators spam (not successful). Core vehicles can counter Warriors, but have no K-bot to assault. AK's useless if enemy have few HLLTs, Thud too weak and expensive. Storm have very bad accuracy when shooting moving targets (rockets are very slow) and reuse too high.

[MR.D]

Here is a little trivia for you.

1v1, 1 ARM lvl-1 Warrior kbot will beat 1 CORE lvl-2 GIMP kbot.

Only thing that Core needs is a Kbot scout about the same class as the Flea, and this "OMFG I'm core and the enemy has snipers" can be gone forever.

If you're arm playing against another arm player thats using snipers, same thing just spam fleas at them, or use Cloaked tanks to sneak up on them, or use spies to scout the snipers and freezebomb self-D the spies.

Levelers are for kicking Kbot ass if you want to totally dominate against pewee/AK/Thud/Hammer spam.

Levelers can barely handle any other vehicles because they damage themselves if the enemy gets too close, and they're too slow to out-maneuver stumpies or Raiders.

If you want to kill levelers and only have flash/gators available, just ram them and watch them destroy themselves.

Janus gets screwed over too for anything except high micro against an equal # of enemies, because of their long reload time.

Janus against Levelers will lose every time as well because of reload time, 1 Janus full direct hit won't kill 1 leveler, so by the time they turn around and almost reload that 2nd kill shot, the leveler will overtake them and eat them up.

[LordMatt]

And as for warriors which use laser weapons, you will find that the simple red lasers are not very effective against Vehicles, for example a stumpy or two could easily take out a warrior. Also Janus's can be used very effectively against stronger T1.
But I must agree, the Core Thud is no match against an Arm Warrior. I think the Warriors rate of fire or damage needs to be dropped to the same as the thuds.

Resource for resource + appropriate micro is that still true? Even if it were, warriors are very expensive units, and if you are letting your opponent spam them, perhaps you are not attacking hard enough or yourself should be considering lvl 2, if it is that point in the game already.

Only thing that Core needs is a Kbot scout about the same class as the Flea, and this "OMFG I'm core and the enemy has snipers" can be gone forever.

MAEK WEZEL, MAEK AK.

I have played more then 100 hours with Highly experienced and Veteran ranked players, and have never seen them used blades and have only once seen gators spam (not successful). Core vehicles can counter Warriors, but have no K-bot to assault. AK's useless if enemy have few HLLTs, Thud too weak and expensive. Storm have very bad accuracy when shooting moving targets (rockets are very slow) and reuse too high.

Until you make better suggestions you are just going to be ignored, so I suggest you go learn why you are incorrect. A start would be to try using these OP units to win games against good players (not good based on rank, but good based on skill). Then watch the demo to see how the countered your supposedly unstoppable strat. Also, based on your comments you have no clue about how to properly micro units to get the maximum effect of them.