Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Minutes of the meetings between Spring developers are archived here.
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abma
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Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by abma » 08 Jan 2012, 17:47

Date: 2-1-2012
Present: jK, zerver, abma, Tobi, hoijui


=== welcome ===
<hoijui>zerver missing, and kloot.. we dont know if will come
<hoijui>hey
<abma>hi all!
<zerver>hi
<abma>anyone heard something from kloot?
<abma>i only read his... a bit confusing message
<abma>oh, before i forget it: Happy new year!
<zerver>indeed, happy happy
<Tobi>happy new year
<jK>or in noppon: "new year! happy happy everyone!"
<hoijui>have a good one!
<hoijui>so...
<hoijui>we folow the etherpad?
<abma>yep?


=== merge or not https://github.com/spring/spring/pull/25 ? ===
<abma>we already talked about that, but afaik we didn't come to a decission
<jK>better make it a module?
<jK>none of us would maintain/use it
<abma>thats reasonable, yep
<abma>other thoughts?
<abma>if not... next point
<abma>+ thanks... i personally had no real opinion about the pull request
<zerver>so it is to allow python to invoke unitsync?
<jK>something like that
<abma>if i understood it right, it will generate a python module which is unitsync
<jK>currently python has to wrap the library and with each update it needs a new wrapper, with that branch it would be a python native module
<zerver>ah

conclusion: will be added if its a submodule (as current devs can't maintain / use it)

=== Release plan ===
<zerver>we need 85.1 with MT fixed
<jK>there are many unsynced bugs currently
<zerver>yeah, I have seen some desyncs
<jK>unsynced
<jK>not synced
<jK>the synced issues are ... better don't comment it
<zerver>okay
<zerver>pathfinding is...
<jK>pathfinding is fine
<abma> http://springrts.com/mantis/view.php?id=2865 ?
<abma>( Excessive movement bouncing off buildings and wreckages )
<zerver>yeah, the obstacle avoidance/bounding is a bit weird
<zerver>and it goes into infinite loop sometimes, bounding forever between two obstacles
<jK>the bouncing is not pathing related
<zerver>I will make MT fixed EXE pretty soon since I don't know when the other unsynced bugs will be fixed
<jK>will possibly fix them this week
<zerver>are they all on mantis?
<jK>no
<jK>there are 2: intel gpu detection fails + SPRING_DATADIR isn't used in isolated mode
<jK>(even in isolated mode the user should be able to define multiple readonly directories, so isolated should only mean that any _automated_ directory including is disabled)
<zerver>yeah
<zerver>I did not know we had intel detection
<jK>new in 85
<zerver>if (intel) exit(-1);
<jK>to disable glsl shaders & loadingMT
<jK>their newest generation is able to run spring at decent FPS
<jK>still it fails in many ways
<zerver>I'm wondering if the LoadingMT driver issue is the same as the glShareLists issue in MT
<jK>possibly still need to add a warning messagebox at first start
<jK>no, LoadingMT, issue is that Mesa fails at garbage collection
<jK>-,
<zerver>okay
<jK>so when the loading opengl context is destructed, it also deletes the textures (or something similar, fact is that the textures are invalid after doing so)
<Tobi>FLOZi is inquiring about http://springrts.com/mantis/view.php?id=2873
<Tobi>in short Q is: is it an intended change that if AllowUnitCreation returns false, factory just keeps trying again and again to build that unit until it finally returns true (which may be never)
<Tobi>?
<Tobi>or is intended behavior for the factory to skip that unit if AllowUnitCreation returns false, and go on with next order?
<jK>it was a undocumented change
<Tobi>intentional or accidental change?
<jK>only kloot knows
<Tobi>baww
<Tobi>ok
<Tobi>I say it is a bug then, not a feature

conclusion: many bugs should be fixed before a release

=== piwik website integration ===
<Tobi>abma_irc: I fixed up and merged that piwik pull request and its running now
<abma>nice!
<abma>uhm, how to login?
<Tobi>seems I need to add users as superuser
<abma>what can users do, expect adding other users?
<Tobi>adminning other stuff maybe
<Tobi>though I guess looking at it is most useful activity right now

conclusion: tobi set up piwik, so we have soon some hopefully nice stats... and you are tracked! :)

=== luasocket integration ===
<abma>btw: i tried to add luasocket to spring
<abma>but imo it would be better to write the required functions ourself as it would be so much work, to restrict access to the existing functions
<abma>also some workerthread would be required, to make it easily useable
<abma>it could be used as it is, as it seems all functions can be run non-blocking
<abma>but i guess this would make the lua-code ugly / hard to maintain
<abma> https://github.com/abma/spring/commits/luasocket
<abma>but uhm... imo not very useful this way
<abma>i would prefer it to be done with some lua-callbacks, like: DataReceived(connectionid, data) or so and use a worker thread
<abma>also luasocket seems to not support ipv6
<Tobi>no worker thread needed, just use O_NONBLOCK and and check every frame
<Tobi>to call a callin there must be synchronization anyway
<abma>hmm
<abma>if i understood the docs of luasocket right, nonblock can / is already be done...
<Tobi>yeah but you wanted to add call-ins on top
<abma>i'm unsure what to do
<Tobi>well
<Tobi>it may give a nicer API, but then those other Lua-only parts of luasocket aren't usable
<abma>for me it currently looks like with this implemntation many has to be coded on the lua side
<Tobi>though then again they are quite probably not really usable anyway because they are blocking
<Tobi>at least in my quick scan of the docs I didn't see a way to do http/smtp/ftp in non-blocking way
<abma>yeah, this has to be rewritten non-blocking in lua...
<abma>maybe i should just try to write a test-download widget
<Tobi>then again that whitelist thing is also still open
<abma>with socket.select() it should be possible to make it nonblocking
<abma>yep
<Tobi>and it seems pretty hard to solve decently
<Tobi>yes
<Tobi>don't even need select if you wait for one socket only
<abma>just call receive with zero timeout?
<Tobi>yep
<Tobi>if it returns EWOULDBLOCK (or whatever Lua equivalent is) then there is no data
<abma>ok, will try then the next days
<abma>and i know about the security problem
<Tobi>I don't really know what to do with this whitelist, just opening sockets completely seems unresponsible, but whitelist can almost not be stored anywhere
<Tobi>cause Lua is a leaky bucket already
<Tobi>config -> can be overwritten by Lua
<abma>yep, i already added a mantis report about that
<Tobi>any file -> can be overwritten by Lua
<Tobi>I thought in the past there was already a check for file access to be limited to spring dir
<abma>yep, triggers an assertion currently
<abma>is it possible to use include() in a lua-widget?
<abma>VFS.include() + "absolute" vfs path VFS.include('LuaUI/Widgets/include/myinclude.lua') for example
<Tobi>not sure
<Tobi>gn
<abma>good night!
<abma>uh, sorry was confusing, this is how it seems to work...

conclusion: luasocket integration seems be reasonable
Last edited by abma on 08 Jan 2012, 18:05, edited 1 time in total.
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smoth
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by smoth » 08 Jan 2012, 18:03

<zerver>pathfinding is...
<jK>pathfinding is fine
<abma>http://springrts.com/mantis/view.php?id=2865 ?
<abma>( Excessive movement bouncing off buildings and wreckages )
<zerver>yeah, the obstacle avoidance/bounding is a bit weird
<zerver>and it goes into infinite loop sometimes, bounding forever between two obstacles
<jK>the bouncing is not pathing related
Good to see someone has the record straight, good on ya JK. I have not seen this bug but people are mighty buttmad about it. IS there a fix coming?
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FLOZi
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by FLOZi » 08 Jan 2012, 18:04

The excessive bouncing has to be the #1 problem with 85 as far as i see it.
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smoth
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by smoth » 08 Jan 2012, 18:28

how do I trigger this bouncing? i have not seen it yet.
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knorke
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by knorke » 09 Jan 2012, 19:34

smoth wrote:how do I trigger this bouncing? i have not seen it yet.
just play some games, eventually you will notice units being thrown around when exiting factory or just bumping into stuff.
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smoth
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by smoth » 09 Jan 2012, 19:55

this sounds hilarious, I have not seen in specing. I will have to play some more vs spawners.
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Beherith
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by Beherith » 09 Jan 2012, 20:43

It is especially bad when seeing the units tried to navigate through closely spaced buildings. Features such as wrecks also cause this behavior.
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Google_Frog
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by Google_Frog » 10 Jan 2012, 08:54

Of course the bouncing is intended but I doubt excessive bouncing was intended. Units just need significantly less bouncyness.
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knorke
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by knorke » 10 Jan 2012, 18:15

Recently there was an anti-lol-bouncing commit:
https://github.com/spring/spring/commit ... 3f8b2e471d
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smoth
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by smoth » 11 Jan 2012, 16:25

knorke wrote:
smoth wrote:how do I trigger this bouncing? i have not seen it yet.
just play some games, eventually you will notice units being thrown around when exiting factory or just bumping into stuff.
Was not as funny as I expected... bouncing is not appropriate.. it is closer to headbutting or humping. I was thinking bouncing like the ghey stuff that happens when a unit lands after falling. This is just a unit being pushed back... lame.
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knorke
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by knorke » 11 Jan 2012, 18:59

it is closer to headbutting or humping.
That is what is supposed to happen when it works normally.

trap (surround) a commander with eg laser towers and use übermicro to make him step over the buildings.

also this:
Image
yes, i tested: it can happen in gundam too, mech walked into a turret and got bounced some hundreds meters. (too lazy for gif, next engine version probally fixes it anyway so enjoy pw-cannons while you still can!)
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smoth
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by smoth » 11 Jan 2012, 19:22

baww I want to see a unit fly randomly in a direction!
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FLOZi
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by FLOZi » 11 Jan 2012, 19:28

smoth wrote:baww I want to see a unit fly randomly in a direction!
Alter a factory yardmap to remove the open yard / make it just too small for a unit.
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Google_Frog
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by Google_Frog » 12 Jan 2012, 15:45

The bouncing problem has been reduced to rapid jittering with the occasional several elmo jerk. This is fine, we've never had much better behaviour in a release without unit that embed themselves in structures.
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knorke
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by knorke » 12 Jan 2012, 20:00

Google_Frog, what test version did you use?
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Google_Frog
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Re: Dev meeting minutes 2012-01-02

Post by Google_Frog » 16 Jan 2012, 11:52

85.0.1-44-gceed8a0
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