Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template - Page 2

Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

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gajop
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by gajop » 17 May 2015, 09:02

I don't think files are really important for a wiki. You can certainly host it elsewhere and link to it.
Media files are the only ones that matter, does that work OK at least?
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Silentwings
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Silentwings » 17 May 2015, 09:06

Images work, but its a bit wierd. It looks like they are all put in the same folder and you cant upload them as part of normal creating/editing. Afaik nothing else does, .lua files certainly don't.
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Forboding Angel » 17 May 2015, 09:46

Exactly... media files are super important for a wiki actually. ESPECIALLY images, and mediawiki makes editing with images extremely irritating. With dokuwiki or github's wiki it's a breeze. I would jump for joy it it were all exported to a dokuwiki setup, but I'll wish in one hand and shit in the other and see which fills up faster.

Suffice it to say, there is a reason why many of us don't really bother contributing to the wiki. The wiki needs to be as pain free as possible, and to the contrary, mediawiki is possibly the most irritating wiki software to work with.

Mediawiki -> dokuwiki exporter (Keeps history intact):
https://www.dokuwiki.org/tips:mediawiki ... _converter

Mediawiki -> Markdown (Not sure if history is preserved :-/)
https://github.com/philipashlock/mediawiki-to-markdown

But lets be honest... pigs will sprout wings before the spring wiki is moved to easier to use software.
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gajop
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by gajop » 17 May 2015, 09:56

Any such drastic change would require a demonstration beforehand.
Port to whatever system you prefer and provide ways to test it with the existing data. If you can't run your own hosts then at least make it easy to do so.
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Silentwings
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Silentwings » 17 May 2015, 10:14

why many of us don't really bother contributing to the wiki
Tbh I find it easy to use and wouldn't rate the mediawiki format as a barrier. Maybe other rare/non-contributors have views?
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Forboding Angel » 17 May 2015, 10:22

Do your contributions have many images involved? If not, well then of course editing is more or less easy. Start involving files or images and mediawiki becomes a huge barrier.

Of course I could always simply use files hosted on my gdrive and images from imgur, but in this instance it is better to host those files on the wiki itself instead of involving external services. At least, imo.

For example, what if imgur suddenly loses all it's files, or goes kaput, etc.
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Silentwings
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Silentwings » 17 May 2015, 11:01

Most wiki pages don't contain images. Adding images is not difficult, just a bit awkward - as said I agree that it doesn't handle images especially well. Lack of syntax highlighting for code is the biggest issue imo.
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FLOZi
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by FLOZi » 17 May 2015, 16:51

You made the 'mediawiki sucks and this is why I don't contribute' before, it's why we ended up with the WYSIWYG editor that you pushed for...
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gajop
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by gajop » 17 May 2015, 17:10

I think our APIs are poorly documented, and not because people didn't put effort. I wish it was possible to have not only an overview, with all the functions listed with their inputs, outputs and a short description, but also a much longer description/detail once you click on each method.
Example: http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/ap ... tions.html

Also we lack linkability, which is often automatically generated and includes cross-section linking.
Example: http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/ap ... .util.Map)

Unity beats us hands down there, even though they don't seem to have syntax highlighting:
http://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/UI.Button.html
+
http://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference ... abled.html

As I said, these are issues with the system, unless someone plans to write everything manually, which seems like a crazy hard task.
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Forboding Angel » 17 May 2015, 19:56

FLOZi wrote:You made the 'mediawiki sucks and this is why I don't contribute' before, it's why we ended up with the WYSIWYG editor that you pushed for...
What WYSIWYG editor? You do know what that acronym means, yes?

What we got was an editor with a proper editing toolbar which was desperately needed.

I have contributed, quite a lot actually. When making articles with illustration images, the process is extremely annoying.
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Silentwings
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Silentwings » 17 May 2015, 20:48

"Desperately needed" is somewhat subjective, I'm not a prolific wiki writer by any means but I made my contributions without noticing the toolbar.

@Forb: It's true that you've contributed; your contributions are almost exclusively towards map making tutorials, which is only one part of the wiki and one which will of course contain more images than most (10, if the log is correct). I guess you already found out, but just in case not, your edits to https://springrts.com/wiki/Springsettings.cfg were in the autogenerated section and were overwritten - the engine source has a place for these iirc.
I think our APIs are poorly documented, and not because people didn't put effort.
Yes, the documentation is much better than in the past. I guess autogenerated docs from comments in the source are how the best examples of other wikis are doing it?
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Forboding Angel » 17 May 2015, 20:55

The spring settings page exists because of me. I made it and manually documented it. Then one of the devs set up a script to auto generate it, but it was first done by me by hand.

There is a long thread about it cause I was bitching that spring removes lines from the settings file when they match default settings which was and still is fucking idiotic.
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gajop
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by gajop » 18 May 2015, 08:01

Silentwings wrote:
I think our APIs are poorly documented, and not because people didn't put effort.
Yes, the documentation is much better than in the past. I guess autogenerated docs from comments in the source are how the best examples of other wikis are doing it?
The javadocs are certainly automatically generated, and it's trivial to do so. I think there was a reason Spring chose to avoid doxygen (similar to javadocs, but slightly better and aimed at a wider variety of languages), but I forgot what it was.
I think this is how we should do it too - document the API in source code and generate from that.

The question is whether examples should also be written in code - it requires extra effort and while that might be suitable for contributions, those would be considerably more difficult if users have to change the source and use Git.
Tutorials or larger examples of usage definitely do not belong in source, but should still have the same properties: (automatic) linking with existing API functions/codes, syntax highlighting and similar.
Forboding Angel wrote:There is a long thread about it cause I was bitching that spring removes lines from the settings file when they match default settings which was and still is fucking idiotic.
That's still being done? Yes it is stupid, as it breaks forward compatibility and confuses the user.
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Forboding Angel » 18 May 2015, 09:24

gajop wrote:
Forboding Angel wrote:There is a long thread about it cause I was bitching that spring removes lines from the settings file when they match default settings which was and still is fucking idiotic.
That's still being done? Yes it is stupid, as it breaks forward compatibility and confuses the user.
Yes :-/

Here is the springsettings documentation thread
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=29747
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AF
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by AF » 04 Jun 2015, 04:25

1. It was FORB, AF & YOU who wanted to switch to wordpress which is a security hole itself!
I keep seeing this, and I'm not sure what WordPress has to do with MediaWiki theming, but if you really do believe WordPress is a security hole, I know a fair few WordPress Core developers who'd like to hear the details.

WordPress is a major open-source project, which also powers the websites of numerous government, antivirus, firewall, and security researchers web presence, and has its own measures for handling disclosure, zero-days, and a security team, and methods for pushing out security updates fast and in most users cases, automatically. If you're going to keep beating the WP isn't secure drum, you should either shut up or be responsible, either report these 'holes' you speak of or link us to them. Just under a quarter of the web uses it, if it was such a security hole it would never have gotten so popular, and we'd be seeing major websites hacked on a daily basis.

If you don't like WordPress then you don't like it, but there's no need to make stuff up. Otherwise I don't see how it's any different given we have proven exploits in software we've already installed on the server
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abma
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by abma » 23 Jul 2015, 17:28

i've updated the test site to mediawiki 1.23.9 (LTS). more exactly i updated it two weeks ago but didn't had the time to adjust the template.

The old template is incompatible, so currently the default template is used. i'm not sure how to continue on this, but we can't use the old/unmaintained wiki forever.

i tried for some minutes to reuse the old template, but it seems thats not possible in an easy way.

see http://test.springrts.com/wiki/ + https://github.com/spring/spring-websit ... 78b6f2f191
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Updating Mediawiki / Using default mediawiki template

Post by Forboding Angel » 24 Jul 2015, 07:53

Please apply this skin to it so that it becomes responsive and possible to further theme as we see fit in the future:
https://github.com/aaronpk/Bootstrap-Skin

Image

Image

The proper grid system is particularly useful for the wiki.

That is unless someone else has a better idea?
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