NOTA 1.82

[smokingwreckage]

How much longer is its range though? If it gets another shot in....

[[Krogoth86]]

Range is about 40% higher than that of a Jethro. With the high reload time it's rather unlikely though to get a second shot on a hit & run plane as they should be out of range again after 4 seconds...

[Thor]

I've found the extra range helps a lot for shooting down napalm bombers.

The advanced factories are somewhat cheaper now, and you'll still want them for the specialized units like merls and penetrators.

[smokingwreckage]

Extra range should also mean better overlap of fields of fire, for a better combination of coverage and focus.

[[Krogoth86]]

Extra range should also mean better overlap of fields of fire, for a better combination of coverage and focus.

Leading to even more missile waste by firing on a "dead" target - it always has two sides...

Imo range isn't the main advantage of such a mobile ground AA. I see it's main purpose in guarding your tanks or whatever ground combat units you have. Even those T2 tanks won't keep a napalm bomber from dropping its payload in its first run as it simply is too fast, the missiles too slow and the range too low to equal that. So it's rather about killing whatever attacked you after its first attack. With the higher damage potential a Jethro has (plus the other advantages) it suits this task much better...

The advanced factories are somewhat cheaper now, and you'll still want them for the specialized units like merls and penetrators.

Still the main question imo is why you put Bulldogs & all the other stuff into the T1 labs. Making T2 labs cheaper already lets you get them faster than usual plus it leads not just to the question of why giving T2 units to a T1 lab but also why those you did? Is there any good reason to give them e.g. a Bulldog and not for example the T2 AA? That also would have made sense as you now were able to build your strong combat units in the T2 labs while doing the AA cover in the T1 labs you still have around giving them some good purpose instead of just delivering some "cannon fodder"...

[Strategia]

With the higher damage potential a Jethro has (plus the other advantages) it suits this task much better...

But the Jethros will likely be dead. The vehicle has a better chance of survival. The Jethros may have higher HP total, but it's distributed over a larger amount of units, so the kill threshold is much lower. This would help against one-on-one ground combat against units armed with lasers and cannons, but against high-AoE units such as napalm bombers, bombers full stop and heavy artillery (incl. MRPC, LRPC, etc.) it's a significant weakness. In essence you trade in some damage potential and survivability in ground fights for survivability in air strikes.

[Thor]

The t2 aa trucks also have a much higher missile velocity compared to jethros, which helps a lot vs. napalms, skirmishing vashps, and enemy fighters that happen to fly nearby.

bulldogs and the rest being built at t1 means that the decisions and investments you made in t1 carry over to t2. If you made 4 t1 vehicle plants, then there's an incentive to go t2 vehicle, since you can use that existing infrastructure to build better units. On the other hand, you still might want to go something different like air to cover your weaknesses. It makes the choices behind teching up more interesting. The reasoning behind choosing bulldogs, indians, advanced infantry, and advanced strat bombers is that they are essentially level 1 units in function, they just have better cost-effectiveness. They're all kind of spammy, non-specialized units.

[Sgt Doom]

Does anyone know which AIs support this mod?

[[Krogoth86]]

@Strategia:
You get about 6 Jethros per AA-Truck. It shouldn't be that difficult to keep them not standing next to each other so there won't be any THAT HUGE disadvantage. Plus you're talking about how their HP only helps in ground-to-ground combat vs. enemies with lasers & stuff. When comparing this with a T2 vehicle it probably is about fighting with T2 vehicles and looking for a good air guard. So the enemy probably wants to have good units to fight T2 tanks and AoE units like a Goliath aren't really the best choice here. So your thought of "this would only help vs laser & co units" actually is an argument for using Jethros as your enemy most certainly will show up with something to fight your ground force and not to fight the AA support behind them...

As the higher tank AA range doesn't do anything against even napalm bombers dropping a full payload there's no real difference here plus usually the enemy will drop on your main force and not on the AA support. You also should be able not to keep your Jethros aligned in a way that the enemie's bomb run will make a perfect line along your Jethros. Plus it even is possible for a Napalm Bomber to kill an AA truck in one run...

The t2 aa trucks also have a much higher missile velocity compared to jethros, which helps a lot vs. napalms, skirmishing vashps, and enemy fighters that happen to fly nearby.

I don't see this being an advantage that equals the huge disadvantages of the truck being T2, having less HP total and delivering less dps than T1 Kbots. If you want to do an " AA shield" you should use fighters and not mobile ground AA so their role is about guarding your troops. Neither the higher missile velocity nor the higer range keeps any bomber from dropping its weapons so imo the only point is about their health and damage output. Plus the point of napalm bombers only applies to Core. When fighting Arm there is no such huge AoE air monster and against gunships the Jethro damage output clearly is superior...

That's why I say that the T2 AA Tank (at least Arm's - didn't check the Core version yet) in fact is no upgrade from what you can get at T1 and isn't really worth building. Besides simply improving stats it might be interesting to give them (additional?) flaks so they can fight high-alt bombers. This might be an advantage that tops Jethros...

[Totbuae]

Sgt Doom, RAI works with NOTA. It's not very competent but at least it builds stuff for you to blow up.

Speaking of AIs, AI Bots are ignoring the prerequisite level 2 constructors for building level 2 units from the level 1 plants. RAI, in particular, has sent Bulldogs against my stuff without first building any level 2 tank constructors.

And, imho, Bulldogs beat all Core tanks if equivalent numbers based on either metal cost or build time are pitted against each other. The Sumo seems to be the Core heavy anti-tank unit.

[smokingwreckage]

I haven't even tried any AI's, since the finest botbashing available is Spacebugs!

[Sgt Doom]

Just had a quick game, and the first thing that caught my eye were the explosions. They feel so powerful, so visceral, and look so beautiful. I was so immersed into it that it felt like my house was shaking with each shell hitting my base.

Sgt Doom, RAI works with NOTA. It's not very competent but at least it builds stuff for you to blow up.

Speaking of AIs, AI Bots are ignoring the prerequisite level 2 constructors for building level 2 units from the level 1 plants. RAI, in particular, has sent Bulldogs against my stuff without first building any level 2 tank constructors.

And, imho, Bulldogs beat all Core tanks if equivalent numbers based on either metal cost or build time are pitted against each other. The Sumo seems to be the Core heavy anti-tank unit.

Thanks, it indeed does work with it, albeit not to it's full potential. I hope the maker of the AI improves compatibility with this mod.

Speaking of which, what is this Spacebugs I hear about?

EDIT: Nevermind, found out i.e. got raped by the Queen bug at around the 2 hour mark D:

[smokingwreckage]

Once you've had bug you can never go back?

Welcome to the fraternity of "I got raped by a giant biomechanical queen bug"

[Sgt Doom]

Once you've had bug you can never go back?

Welcome to the fraternity of "I got raped by a giant biomechanical queen bug"

Ah well, at least it was female

[Strategia]

Ah well, at least it was female

This of course implies that the basic reproductive anatomy of simple Terran lower insectoid species is at all similar to that of gigantic space monsters of DOOM. For all you know, you just got tentacle'd harder than a typical Japanese cartoon schoolgirl

.....I'll stop now.

[smokingwreckage]

.....I'll stop now.

THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!

[Argh]

Welcome to the fraternity of "I got raped by a giant biomechanical queen bug"

Classic.

[Sgt Doom]

Ah well, at least it was female

This of course implies that the basic reproductive anatomy of simple Terran lower insectoid species is at all similar to that of gigantic space monsters of DOOM. For all you know, you just got tentacle'd harder than a typical Japanese cartoon schoolgirl

.....I'll stop now.

But what if I get turned on by that?

...Anyway, I shall stop also and focus my efforts on destroying she who took my virginity so violently.

[Strategia]

But what if I get turned on by that?

Then I recommend checking certain other websites as well. They should be more appropriate to your tastes.

[Master-Athmos]

Another question that comes to my mind:
Was it on purpose that Core has no Spy K-Bot in their K-Bot labs (just as no Spy-Bot at all) while Arm has one ? I saw that you actually have a unit def for a Core Spy-KBot but it's not being used...

Imo Core should have it too...

Plus did you check out that fixed version of custom formations yet?