P.U.R.E. RC4.2 - Page 7

P.U.R.E. RC4.2

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thesleepless
Posts: 417
Joined: 24 Oct 2007, 04:49

Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by thesleepless »

Argh wrote:Hmm. What happens if you /give the Unit? Try /give miner, tell me what happens.
give works fine, it seems to only crash every time i build stuff, it builds for a second or two then freezes.
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Andromeda
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Joined: 01 Oct 2008, 03:59

Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Andromeda »

Froze up about halfway through building a Resistance Mex :cry: This was one of those annoying times when task manager didn't show :(
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MidKnight
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by MidKnight »

Argh wrote:CA isn't even roughly equivalent. They still have a lot of old models in the game, last time I looked. They don't have World Builder. They don't have anything like the typical unit-count. It's like comparing a tiny one-pound hammer with a sledgehammer, tbh.
We don't have you, smoth, GMN, rattle, Gnome, Spiked, or any other wicked and insanely dedicated modeler on the CA team. You can't expect us to pump out an amazing IP-free mod that quickly. :wink:


expect my comments on PURE once the download finishes :P
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the great zamboni
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by the great zamboni »

Lurker you are god, always wanted to play the damn 1944 game. Mucho Thankee.
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Otherside
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Otherside »

CA's s3o models total up to around PURE's Total unit count for both faction's put together maybe even more

PURE hogs alot more fps

Think its due to worldbuilder + mass CEG


i still have acceptable fps in PURE (over 60 Majority of time) but with CA i have around double framerate on average

afaik CA uses DXT3/5 on most s3o's without any noticeable artifacts (most units are 512*512)
Last edited by Otherside on 13 Mar 2009, 12:45, edited 1 time in total.
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AF
AI Developer
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by AF »

You forget the extra lighting shaders and generally larger and more detailed textures
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lurker
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by lurker »

But some of the textures are quite oversized for what they have.
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zwzsg
Kernel Panic Co-Developer
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by zwzsg »

So, your only answer is "Buy new PC"? I find it it hard to accept, I played a bit of RC3 and it does not have Crysis grade graphics. Even if PURE might be prettier and better than any other mod, it's nowhere near anything that would explain getting 1 frame per 30s at 640x480 when the game just started and there's only the starting unit(s) on screen.

You talk about halving the textures, but have you even tested and measured if the textures are really the bottleneck?
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AF
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by AF »

If a system has integrated graphics I would assume it is the cpu being maxed out in poor conditions, which for the most part is an engine problem.

While spring is not crysis grade visually, it is far less efficient.
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zwzsg
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by zwzsg »

The PC is tried Pure RC4 on is my Personal P.C.. It has a non-integrated video card which wasn't bad when I bought it, two years ago. The slow down I experienced is so out of the the scale blaming my GPU is not a plausible explanation. Getting 1 frame per second at endgame could be explained by Pure having higher min req, getting 1 frame per 30s at game start, not.

On another note, I tried Spring 7.8.2.1 on two non-personal non-gaming PCs with integrated graphic cards, with another mod, and it was actually playable. One of them required that I installed the GPU drivers first, but that's all (and surprisingly the title of the Spring error popup was quite clear about that).

The P in PC already stands for Personal, which make it kinda fun to talk about Personal PC and non-personal PC

Basically, what I want to say is that there is something else other than Pure raising the min specification bar. There's something broken in Pure, that should be looked into and fixed.
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theotherhiveking
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by theotherhiveking »

I havent seen it reported anywhere else, so i assume its a unreported bug.

The sniper crashes the game when he kneels, also he doesnt seem to be able to shoot...

Btw: I LOVE the mod sounds, they are all awesome, i really liked the voices.


Well, i loved all except one, the 'light mech walking', Its really annoying, and it gets even worse when you hear it 15 times per second.

its like when you enter a class and everyone moves the chairs to sit down.
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Argh
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Argh »

Basically, what I want to say is that there is something else other than Pure raising the min specification bar. There's something broken in Pure, that should be looked into and fixed.
Well, whatever it is, it's not something that shows up on any of our test hardware, it didn't go away when you removed the GLSL... so I'm not entirely sure what you're seeing, and why it doesn't happen over here. For all I know, it's a machine-specific problem, driver issue, or special instruction-set problem at a deep level that's only being exposed in Spring because I'm using certain advanced features.

On the general issue of performance:

1. I would like to explore with anybody willing to contribute some time and expertise the idea of making a Lua-based solution, that would assign smaller textures before gamestart. I have no idea where to go with that, I'm assuming that UnitDefs could be manipulated without generating a different sync hash, if it was done based on a config once the sim starts.

However, it's hard to see how that's not going to affect all players equally. I don't think it's going to work out.

However, taking that route means an even larger size to the current demo. That won't take it out of the sizes of a typical demo for a commercial game these days, or even a large mod (I just downloaded a 400+MB mod for a game I play occasionally, where 300MB was textures), but it's a consideration.

2. I've already talked to the engine developers about texturemap controls, and that's something that can be done but will not be instantaneous.

3. There are serious performance issues in Spring that are revealed as we build things like this where we're close to the wall. I've already talked about these things (the map drawing and sound code in particular). The map drawing may or may not be moving forward, I'm not sure, the sound code is almost complete.

World Builder and P.U.R.E. represent change, guys. I'll do what I can, to mitigate things, but I can make no guarantees that we'll arrive at a situation where the game's playable for all hardware that can play other Spring games.
Last edited by Argh on 13 Mar 2009, 22:22, edited 1 time in total.
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smoth
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by smoth »

I wish I had realized it earlier but I didn't remember until this weekend, you may want to look at a slightly different name for world builder as there is already a tool that is out there as a commercial product.
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Argh
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Argh »

There are actually multiple World Builders. It's a generic name, I'm not concerned about it.
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smoth
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by smoth »

oh damn, really? That is pretty wild.
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Argh
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Argh »

Yeah. There's some software for manipulating heightmaps, a tool for building levels for a big commercial game (i.e., it's really quite similar) and other stuff. Do a Google.

It's one of those names that just keeps getting used because it's descriptive. I'd only worry about changing the name if somebody made an issue of it, tbh.

It's like the name P.U.R.E., where Disney hasn't shown any interest in bothering me even though if they're paying any attention at all they have to know I exist.
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Andromeda
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Andromeda »

I just tried a game of /give and I had a four Overlords facing off against a fairly large group of Resistance units, (I don't remember the exact number) and no problems at all. the only time it crashes is when i try to build something, so i guess i will have to make do with staging battles using /give :|
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Google_Frog
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Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Google_Frog »

Crashed while testing, it looked like a unit just got EMPed.

Also I found out why I couldn't see the hp bars. I had disabled it for being ugly and useless compared to jks when I tried RC3 and Spring remembered the lua setting.

I think you should address the ugly and useless problems with the hp bar.
It's ugly because:
  • It's really bulky
  • It doesn't get smaller when you zoom out or larger when you zoom in.
  • The bars deplete from both ends
  • The colours change depending on bar fullness which makes it hard to take in with a glance.
Useless because:
  • It doesn't show reload time on long reload weapons.
  • It doesn't show shield fullness
  • It doesn't show EMP.
  • It doesn't give a percentage filled for each bar.
  • The bars aren't labeled.
Attachments
infolog.txt
Crash
(22.26 KiB) Not downloaded yet
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thesleepless
Posts: 417
Joined: 24 Oct 2007, 04:49

Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by thesleepless »

still no luck building in PURE, tried disabling all widgets too. still freezes about 2 seconds after starting a building...

nothing is written to the console or infolog

anyone else having this problem?
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Eman
Posts: 37
Joined: 07 Mar 2009, 01:38

Re: P.U.R.E. RC4.1

Post by Eman »

Look 2 posts up from yours. :roll:

Any chance you are using an older ATI card?
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