Why hasn't DSD been banned?

[Fuel]

Banning a popular map is a bit extreme.
DSD is played alot more during the evening time in Europe.
I think there's almost always someone willing to play 1 vs 1 or FFA, just ask.

DSD is not completely dull though.
There are some occasional interesting fun battles on DSD, and I am not talking about usual tech / porc scheme.
You can team up with someone and push in the north hills, it can be fun.

But I do agree that it tends to become boring.
I think the problem is with the maps, there are too few good maps on the hosts suitable for team battles, if that's what you are interested in.

[Johannes]

But I do agree that it tends to become boring.
I think the problem is with the maps, there are too few good maps on the hosts suitable for team battles, if that's what you are interested in.

Not really, already going for DSD duo or whatever it's called, is tons more exciting than plain DSD. Problem is that if I'd make open dynamic maps designed for big teams, that I'd like to play, most DSD players wouldn't be comfortable in such environment so they wouldn't get played.

[knorke]

there are too few good maps on the hosts suitable for team battles

Imo there are too many bad maps:

<[2up]knorke> !listmaps
<Spads5> Too many results (1879), please use a filter string by using "!list maps <filter>" syntax

There are lots of good maps, it is just impossible to find them.

!nextmap should always bring a random GOOD map, instead it brings horror maps.
For example recently in [ACE] FFA host:
http://pastebin.com/frvHrJVg
See timestamps: 14 minutes from joining room to game start, even if multiple times all players had map and were ready.
But always new players join or leave and new map must be found etc.
Sometimes takes even longer. ACE is imo quite good with its page with map pictures but still has this problem.

I think DSDness is also result of players being tired of constantly downloading crappy maps due to !nextmap and similiar annoyance. At least it works, will start fast, no hassle.
A well managed autohost could change that and make other maps attractive, too.


For example have a small pool of 5 good maps.
Maps are of different size, one for 2v2, one for 4v4, one for large games etc.
Only those will be used for !nextmap
Every 2 weeks pick 5 new maps.
(I hoped zero-Ks "featured map" system would become like this but they just made all maps featured, so it is defeats the idea)

Playing same map multiple times is actually good for an RTS, it helps create balance and strategies. BA on DSD is maybe the only spring match where something as a meta-game exists. Not just in head of game devs but also for players. Still it is played out, overdone since years now.
First host to implent something like above system would have me back as BA player.

[PicassoCT]

How about a personal best map list, that provides the next suggestion, always alternating between players?

[Johannes]

See timestamps: 14 minutes from joining room to game start, even if multiple times all players had map and were ready.
But always new players join or leave and new map must be found etc.
Sometimes takes even longer.

Yeah, this hassle is the biggest offender why games take long to start. When joining the game is not locked at a certain threshold, it's really hard to have a stable situation long enough that everyone's ready without another guy coming in and postponing the start again. Actually I thought I wrote a post about this already but guess I accidentally left it unposted. Back when we had human hosts it was simpler when you could simply had a clear goal in mind about what kind of game will be played, and could enforce that swiftly. Now even if there is an autohost admin present, if he starts speccing people and picks a map without voting, people will complain since their freedoms was taken away.

Playing same map multiple times is actually good for an RTS, it helps create balance and strategies. BA on DSD is maybe the only spring match where something as a meta-game exists.

Firstly that's not what meta-game means, secondly even if it meant what you mean, it's not true. CCR, Red Comet, Geyser, Tabula, SoW (ok not anymore), etc etc all have pretty well defined staple strategies. And common DSD strategies are honestly pretty garbage, give me 8 coms and their starting metal and I'll guarantee I'll trash a usual DSD team easily while doing something totally different.

[knorke]

Meta-game was maybe wrong word. What I meant is that DSD is the most understood teams-map. (1v1 is different)
On other maps you have pre-game discussion about where to start, people draw lines with "defense here" marker etc.
On DSD that is largely not needed anymore: when someone says "me eco" all players know where he will start and his build order. Not just pro players but normal average ones too.

[Johannes]

That doesn't mean it's understood, the common strategies employed by average players are more cargo cult than anything else. But when you have players of such wide spectrum of skill and little trust for each other, you cannot expect proper cooperation outside the usual rotes.

[knorke]

Even if some is cargo cult, on other maps you have "can bots cross this?" markers. Imo a noticeable step up.
I am not saying it is perfect

[smoth]

cargo cult

why have you been citing this term lately? do you understand it?

[knorke]

have i?

do you understand it?

no, i just picked it up and use it since then.

[smoth]

ok so it is just something funny you are using and not something meant to set context. nonsense is fine to.

[Johannes]

I don't get what's so funny or nonsense here, nor do I know where has cargo cult term been thrown around, not on this forum at least.

[PicassoCT]

Back to topic: when will we succed at banning speed metall? Coporate world will laugh at us, if OS doesent get its own content dictatorship floating downriver?

[Floris]

Creating randomly new DSD variations here!

[smoth]

God, it looks so bad. What am I looking at?

[Floris]

this

[smoth]

Maybe it is that my phone is not liading the whole image but all I see is blurry crap in that shot

[Cheesecan]

I prefer juggernaut.

[smoth]

loaded it on my pc. why do you guys like the DOF shit. if the real world looks that way, update your prescription NOW.

[CarRepairer]

Question for the OP (since this thread is still alive and kicking): How do you ban a map? Do you ban it by name? Someone can rename it and still play. Do you ban the user? There are no rules against playing a map. You want to add that to the list of rules - No DSD? Do you want to take the time to make some code that detects if a map is really similar to DSD? How similar should it be?

Have I reduced it to absurdity yet or should I go on?