Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

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eyu100
Posts: 182
Joined: 05 Jul 2008, 04:10

Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by eyu100 »

In this replay, if you look at the map, west seems to be clearly winning - it has complete control over the south and is invading both the north and the south. However, if you use a widget to count the amount of metal (including the metal stored in units and structures) that each ally team has, east has significantly more. So who wins? West, with their huge territorial advantage? East, with their moderate metal advantage? As it turns out, east wins easily.

The biggest player on east (Senna) had a huge amount of eco in a fairly small base. Using all the metal and energy he had, he defeated west's northern army with T2 gunships and stopped their south invasion with krows. He then built a buzzsaw and destroyed most of west's eco, winning the game for his team almost single-handedly. Keep this in mind the next time rzbx tells you to push with T1 (or even T2) instead of teching :wink: . Teching can be effective even when it leads to huge territorial losses!
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Beherith
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Joined: 26 Oct 2007, 16:21

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by Beherith »

Especially if the teams starting mexes are worth twice as much as the initially uncontested mexes - you are not fighting to gain metal spots, you are fighting to keep your starting mexes and make the most of them.
When there is nothing to expand to, territory becomes worthless as it is in contested areas and requires resources expended for defending it.
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Senna
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Joined: 17 Mar 2009, 00:20

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by Senna »

:D
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Senna
Posts: 315
Joined: 17 Mar 2009, 00:20

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by Senna »

i could won the game mutch more early, but i want to have some fun:).

and i said i would make a lolcannon!!
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Johannes
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Joined: 17 Sep 2010, 15:49

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by Johannes »

Didn't watch replay but reclaim = great econ, even on DSD. You just have to know when making more units will not give you more reclaim in the short term and invest in static econ at those times.

Of course economy is the most important thing on any map, just varies on map what kind of economy you want to go for.

Also keep in mind that in mass games like this, it's much more beneficial to have economy in the hands of 1 player than scattered between several, because teams don't tend to cooperate so that single player with concentrated econ can do something focused instead of doing 5 different things half-assedly.
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AF
AI Developer
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Joined: 14 Sep 2004, 11:32

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by AF »

Nobody gains territory for the sake of having the most ( well some do )

Territory conveys allsorts of advantages ( e.g. metal spots aka economy )
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zerver
Spring Developer
Posts: 1358
Joined: 16 Dec 2006, 20:59

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by zerver »

If you dislike it, my mutator Red Annihilation puts more focus on territory, since it does not have metal maker econ.

http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=27173
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smoth
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Joined: 13 Jan 2005, 00:46

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by smoth »

eyu100:

http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=44

there is a whole space devoted to ba!
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SirArtturi
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Joined: 23 Jan 2008, 18:29

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by SirArtturi »

No, Ego is much more important...
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1v0ry_k1ng
Posts: 4656
Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 10:24

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by 1v0ry_k1ng »

just one more reason BA DSD is the territory of unimaginative noobstars :(
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Wombat
Posts: 3379
Joined: 15 Dec 2008, 15:53

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by Wombat »

every time Kais made map i was like 'shitty mex at start plox, epic in the middle' but he never listen and BA died :(
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Pako
Posts: 174
Joined: 12 Jul 2009, 18:57

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by Pako »

Any excellent player should be able to win a game with a take.

It is one of the best strentgh of BA how winning team can easily turn to a losing team because the losing team got little scared and winning team got too sure of themselves.

DSD is a good map for that and the tool to make it happen is balanced metalmaker economy. Less effective MMs make games go a lot longer and less effective makes eco spam the only way to win.

Strength of popular music is it is good music and BADSD is most fun, of course elitist mental nerds hate popular things even more than they love them-self.
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sillynanny
Posts: 125
Joined: 20 Jun 2008, 14:26

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by sillynanny »

Hating DSD is so cool man! DSD is gay!

But seriously, I think one of the strengths of DSD is that the terrain of the base clearly defines the role of the player. Players in the back tech, the front pushes, and a few spots can choose one or the other. Compared to other maps like Tabula, the "tech" spots in Tabula are much less clearly defined, more dangerous, and are probably no tech spots at all, even thou late game can be just as important in Tabula.

I wonder how well a map with written player roles on the start spots would do.
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albator
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Joined: 14 Jan 2009, 14:20

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by albator »

Completely wrong for XvsX | X less than 5

If you play DSD more than 5v5, learn to read description and blame yourself
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sillynanny
Posts: 125
Joined: 20 Jun 2008, 14:26

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by sillynanny »

There is no need to blame anyone, I enjoy it.

You kids are full of pointless hate. It REALLY doesn't make you look cool.
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the above
Posts: 18
Joined: 28 Dec 2011, 13:45

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by the above »

Playing DSD, that's what the cool kids do.
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sillynanny
Posts: 125
Joined: 20 Jun 2008, 14:26

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by sillynanny »

Being cool is not about what maps you play in spring. It's about who and what you are.
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1v0ry_k1ng
Posts: 4656
Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 10:24

Re: Eco is much more important than territory in BA DSD

Post by 1v0ry_k1ng »

Pako wrote:It is one of the best strentgh of BA how winning team can easily turn to a losing team because the losing team got little scared and winning team got too sure of themselves.

DSD is a good map for that and the tool to make it happen is balanced metalmaker economy. Less effective MMs make games go a lot longer and less effective makes eco spam the only way to win.

Strength of popular music is it is good music and BADSD is most fun, of course elitist mental nerds hate popular things even more than they love them-self.
8v8 BA DSD requires minimal player interaction and decision making compared to just about any other setup. It also places almost no responsibility on the individual player for the win or lose.

I think of it like a rusk, for a baby. Very plain, very safe and discarded in favor of real food upon the development of teeth
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