Balanced Annihilation 7.31 - Page 11

Balanced Annihilation 7.31

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BaNa
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by BaNa » 29 Apr 2011, 14:36

HectorMeyer wrote: A good solution might be to calculate a random position near the actual target once, and then randomize each shot around this position. That would realistically model the behaviour of an artillerist that calculates the target positon to the best of his knowledge, while being aware that there is a certain level of error in it.
very nice idea, i like it.
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hoijui
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by hoijui » 29 Apr 2011, 14:48

that is actually exactly what it is like now, just that this random spot is slowly moving around, and the randomized-around-that-point is done by weapon inaccuracy. The slowly moving around of the central point also makes sense compared to reality, as nobody would shell for days around a single, approximated point if a few direct hits would kill the target, and statistics say that if the target really was in that approximated location, it would be dead now with 95% certainty.
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HectorMeyer
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by HectorMeyer » 29 Apr 2011, 15:10

Yes, not everything has to be modeled 100% realistic. The slow shift works more or less ok for unprecise weapons like artillery (you get enough weapon accuracy error to hit the target sometimes), but it makes precise weapons like lasers hit the same wrong spot over and over again, while they wait for the shift. The annihilator having enemy structures in range is also a good example for this.
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Ares
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Ares » 29 Apr 2011, 16:50

The laser vs plasma dynamic is a good one, each has pros and cons. Based on your intel preferences you may need to consider your options.

I think laser shots do wobble, eventually you will end up hitting the target, it just comes down to time and luck when its laser vs laser, no LOS. Perhaps this process is too slow but as you pay such a premium for plasma I think it's probably well balanced.

If there is some kind of DMZ covered by turrets - consequently stopping you using units for LOS, the dragons eye has filled the niche for me in the past. If the enemy turret fires at two of your units you could triangulate position from this and do a manual ground attack. Also, by the time you are using annihilators in any quantity you could always consider targetting facilities.
Last edited by Ares on 29 Apr 2011, 17:21, edited 1 time in total.
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Pxtl
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Pxtl » 29 Apr 2011, 17:01

The HLT has slightly lower range than the radar tower has *sight* range (not radar range). Build a radar-tower directly adjascent to your HLT for spotting duties and your HLT shots will ding every time.

Radar towers are inexpensive and have low energyuse.

Or place a Slasher next to it.
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Nixa
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Nixa » 02 May 2011, 06:20

Pxtl wrote:Or place God next to it.
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Johannes
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Johannes » 02 May 2011, 13:28

I don't see any problem with how radar wobble works now. If you see your turret constantly shooting at a bad spot, manually target to where you think the real enemy might be. Or target a place where enemies are more tightly packed, then you're more likely to hit.

And Annihilator targetin enemy structures... Just scout the structures once, and they won't wobble anymore!

Stuff overshooting their range when shooting at dots is a problem though, maybe it could be fixed by just killing the projectiles after a certain time?
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Wombat
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Wombat » 02 May 2011, 15:48

I don't see any problem with how radar wobble works now
Stuff overshooting their range when shooting at dots is a problem though
anyway, its not the problem of projectiles only (can be fixed like pitbull). laser weapons got the same issie (tho, the 'range' is not that ridiculous like in case of viper)
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Johannes
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Johannes » 02 May 2011, 16:08

With lasers, I think it's because the range circle is calculated from the centre of the unit, but the laser gun is a small distance off from the center, so it gets that much "extra" range. But, it's always the same and pretty small amount, it's not unpredictable like that viper for example. Lasers just vanish at max range, instead of continuing indefinitely like viper does.
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TradeMark
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by TradeMark » 18 May 2011, 13:30

i am quite pissed you changed the fbi into lua, now i cant use modit at all... thx for nothing.

so, how do you edit lua files now? by hands?

is it even possible to edit them programmatically and output the changed lua file ?

where is the lua reader script that converts lua into fbi/tdf formats?
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Beherith
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Beherith » 18 May 2011, 14:49

Since almost all unit information has been moved to the unit's individual .lua files, I dont think it should be too much of an issue for you to finally roll with the times.
http://pastebin.com/FwhcQXhV
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TradeMark
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by TradeMark » 18 May 2011, 15:32

yeah i knew you were just bitching on me with these changes, and by not answering my questions you're only confirming this fact.

have fun not being able to edit mods with editors specifically made for them.
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Niobium
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by Niobium » 18 May 2011, 15:55

TradeMark wrote:i am quite pissed you changed the fbi into lua, now i cant use modit at all... thx for nothing.
TradeMark wrote:have fun not being able to edit mods with editors specifically made for them.
Either update your tools or accept their fate as everyone moves to Lua. That the old format requires special editors is an argument against it in itself, with Lua I do all my processing using a small widget.
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TradeMark
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by TradeMark » 18 May 2011, 16:22

Niobium wrote:Either update your tools or accept their fate as everyone moves to Lua.
I dont care about the modit anymore since i dont make any mods nor do i play Spring games anymore, but others care, and im not going to waste my time on this because some idiot chose this is a smart way to go because he was too lazy to build an editor that would help grouping the data files to be visible on a single page, but instead... we have now changed and messed the whole data structure and theres no way of knowing what kind of structure the people will be using. And i find it fucking stupid that the parts which can be used by multiple units will be glued into one file (weapons, corpses etc).
Niobium wrote:That the old format requires special editors is an argument against it in itself
i never said that was an argument nor that it requires special editors. The point was: in lua you cant edit the files except manually by hands, and if you magically can, then the whole point of using lua in the DATA files is the real "argument against itself" (see more whine below).
Niobium wrote:with Lua I do all my processing using a small widget.
So its possible to save the lua scripts correctly after editing their arrays :shock: ? Then what the hell was the point of converting the files into Lua if you are going to use a widget to display/edit the data anyways????? FUCK...

The lazyness of you devs only cause more problems. The only gain you get by this is to piss me off, and thats what Beherith here enjoys! When does he stop the grudge? Get over it man...
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smoth
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by smoth » 18 May 2011, 17:44

Weapons, corpses and unitdefs are parsed by different fils. I suspect if you really looked at te lua file it would prove better structured.
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TradeMark
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by TradeMark » 18 May 2011, 17:59

The lua version will work as designed ONLY if every unit uses exactly once each of the definitions. if you want, for example, use the same weapon for 10 units, you have to move it to a different file anyways, that will defeat the whole point of using a system where every thing is in one file.

This whole system is just a hack that fucks with all the other devs, since there is no guarantee where you put the files, you have to guess, you cant know where to look up them anymore. And now when every DATA file can be scripted, there is absolutely no guarantee everyone who edits them will know how it will affect the outcome, bugs arise. There was no fucking problems with plain old "ini" style data. I never had any problems. Nor did TFC, which we made clear we wouldnt use lua crap in BA (he said he wouldnt convert them to lua since it would render modit useless)... but too bad the devs changed to CA wannabes who put lua in every fking hole now, just because its the new frigging trend!
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smoth
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by smoth » 18 May 2011, 18:22

I don't have my weapons defs in the unit fie and even if I did it is just an extra check anyway
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TradeMark
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by TradeMark » 18 May 2011, 19:09

yeah, see, even smoth knows it is pointless to crap them all in one file
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SinbadEV
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by SinbadEV » 18 May 2011, 19:14

@smoth and TradeMark etc.

RE: Lua migration etc.

I don't know what you are talking about but I think it would be best to move this discussion to a new thread or just stop entirely before someone starts using size and color tags.
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TradeMark
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Re: Balanced Annihilation 7.31

Post by TradeMark » 18 May 2011, 19:42

no. this is about BA 7.31, where else would i post.

im still AARGGHHHH though
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