[IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure - Page 3

[IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Discuss the source code and development of Spring Engine in general from a technical point of view. Patches go here too.

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Neddie
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Neddie »

I don't have one on Windows 7 Ultimate either.
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SpliFF
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by SpliFF »

Code: Select all

Windows XP Environment Variables

    Environment Variable 	Path
    %ALLUSERSPROFILE% 	C:\Documents and Settings\All Users
    %APPDATA% 	C:\Documents and Settings\{username}\Application Data
    %COMMONPROGRAMFILES% 	C:\Program Files\Common Files
    %COMMONPROGRAMFILES(x86)% 	C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files
    %COMSPEC% 	C:\Windows\System32\cmd.exe
    %HOMEDRIVE% 	C:
    %HOMEPATH% 	C:\Documents and Settings\{username}
    %PROGRAMFILES% 	C:\Program Files
    %PROGRAMFILES(X86)% 	C:\Program Files (x86) (only in 64-bit version)
    %SystemDrive% 	C:
    %SystemRoot% 	C:\Windows
    %TEMP% and %TMP% 	C:\Documents and Settings\{username}\Local Settings\Temp
    %USERPROFILE% 	C:\Documents and Settings\{username}
    %WINDIR% 	C:\Windows

Windows Vista and 7 Environment Variables

    Environment Variable 	Path
    %ALLUSERSPROFILE% 	C:\ProgramData
    %APPDATA% 	C:\Users\{username}\AppData\Roaming
    %COMMONPROGRAMFILES% 	C:\Program Files\Common Files
    %COMMONPROGRAMFILES(x86)% 	C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files
    %COMSPEC% 	C:\Windows\System32\cmd.exe
    %HOMEDRIVE% 	C:
    %HOMEPATH% 	C:\Users\{username}
    %LOCALAPPDATA% 	C:\Users\{username}\AppData\Local
    %PROGRAMDATA% 	C:\ProgramData
    %PROGRAMFILES% 	C:\Program Files
    %PROGRAMFILES(X86)% 	C:\Program Files (x86) (only in 64-bit version)
    %PUBLIC% 	C:\Users\Public
    %SystemDrive% 	C:
    %SystemRoot% 	C:\Windows
    %TEMP% and %TMP% 	C:\Users\{username}\AppData\Local\Temp
    %USERPROFILE% 	C:\Users\{username}
    %WINDIR% 	C:\Windows
That's a complete list. There is no %MYGAMES%. Jools is wrong. Again.
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Jools
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Jools »

yuritch wrote:Just checked on a Win7 Home, and there is no %mygames% var (nor is there anything resembling a localized version of it, and MS does not localize env var names anyway). Maybe some game you installed created it?
Yeah, must be. Or I created it myself and have forgotten about it. I also have a %spring% and a %spads% environment variable. Doesn't everyone have a spring environment variable? I mean environment variables->user (and not not system ones).
varikonniemi
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by varikonniemi »

I understand that ~/.config/spring/ is the standards compliant location for springrc, but as spring also use ~/.spring folder would this not be a better place for it?

Why split it up into two places?
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hoijui
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by hoijui »

this way, you can backup or replicate your configuration more easily (all the configuration of the user, not just the spring one), i don;t know if there are other reasons, but well.. in general the reasons to do it, are the ones they invented the standard in the first place. the standard has practical reasons, it is not just "cause it is the standard". if you want to know more, read about the standard.
varikonniemi
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by varikonniemi »

Then the content folder should be in ~/.local/share/spring/ and not ~/.spring/ ?

The way i thought it works is to use the XDG spec OR a single .dir in home for everything OR a single .file in home.
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hoijui
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by hoijui »

i guess it makes sense to put data into ~/.local/share/spring/ then. the problem there would be, i expect, that spring uses the data-dir for lots of stuff, like reading data files from (maps, games), writing log files to, reading configuration files from (there is not just the spring config, but also the AI related lua files), loading shared libs from (AI Interfaces and native AIs), ...
all this would have to be split properly first. some of it might be done already. i guess, this would be a perfect project for a newcommer dev. it should be quite easy and not too time consuming.
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Forboding Angel
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Forboding Angel »

~/.spring should be ~/spring anyway. There is no decent reason to hide the directory.
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Anarchid
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Anarchid »

~/.spring should be ~/spring anyway. There is no decent reason to hide the directory.
And then everybody does it like this and suddenly your ~ is filled with 100500 directories and you can't find anything.

There's a good enough reason.
gajop
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by gajop »

Content such as maps, games, AIs and missions should be in ~/spring, but configs should be in ~/.config/spring probably
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Forboding Angel
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Forboding Angel »

I don't always hide important folders, but when I do I make sure to screw over computer noobs by hiding something important. Like maps, games and infolog.
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danil_kalina
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by danil_kalina »

gajop wrote:Content such as maps, games, AIs and missions should be in ~/spring, but configs should be in ~/.config/spring probably
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: sorry
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hoijui
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by hoijui »

if the user decides that spring or your game is important, he can make a symlink. if a game maker decides that his game is important, he can make a symlink at install-time (i think it is a bad idea.. pretentious).
we have no business in deciding for the user what is important. some people open the software manager of their distro, search for "game" or "RTS", and then click on a few things, install them, and try them one by one. most people that try some spring game once, will not play again, or only few times. this is again the same thing.. a balance between being responsibly/social, and forcing what we/you think is right and important onto others. in such situations, the community has proven to choose the first way, and forb has proven to prefer the second, and go on and on and on about it without adding anything new.
play it one more time, sam!
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danil_kalina
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by danil_kalina »

hoijui wrote:....., bla bla bla , .....
Listen to your master. you'll be alright !
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Forboding Angel
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Forboding Angel »

So... Being able to manipulate maps and games isn't important?

Hi, welcome to spring. You must be new here.

Hoijui, I tend to fight for common sense and for users to not get the short end of the stick. You, on the other hand, will happily give the end user the shaft if it allows you to feel as though you have some sort of moral highground. For you, it is about ego. for me, it is about what is best for everyone.

In this case, hiding infolog, maps and games, is utterly ridiculous and doesn't help anyone.
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hoijui
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by hoijui »

the point is, that it is not about spring, but about the computer of a user. the user has lots of software installed, spring being one of them. spring is unimportant. if for spring, manipulating maps and games is important, it is still unimportant for the user, because spring is unimportant. if the user decides that spring is important, then he can make a symlink. if he is not tech-savy enough for that, then he will not want to manipulate files manually. the lobby should show him the log file, download stuff for him, and let him open the respective folders in extreme cases (eg. "Open maps folder" button).
a user is in general not a spring user, but a computer user. you are the ego guy, for thinking it is all about your game/spring.

side note: it is quite ridiculous making a post about how you are morally superior (which is what you just did), blaming me for doing the same thing.
"what you do is so stupid! let me do the same!"
say that it is stupid, or do the same, but don't do both. doing both is stupid. sometimes, less is more.
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danil_kalina
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by danil_kalina »

hoijui wrote:bla
you know so many about users, about their behaviour, about what they need and don't need, about what is important or less important.

what a heck are you doing then ? you should make lobby instead of being spring engine developer

why engine has such mess with the folders and files ?
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smoth
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by smoth »

gajop wrote:Content such as maps, games, AIs and missions should be in ~/spring, but configs should be in ~/.config/spring probably
is ~ userland?

what about spring games that have different spring settings? what about multiple engine version installs? Seems short sighted.
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Silentwings
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Silentwings »

I think putting infolog anywhere even slightly difficult to find is a bad idea - its the basic tool for bugfixing anything. Mod devs often need to see their payers infologs when they complain of some widget/gfx error, and quite a few times times a bug has been repored because I (and presumably others too) persuaded a user to upload their infolog to mantis.
gajop
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by gajop »

smoth wrote:
gajop wrote:Content such as maps, games, AIs and missions should be in ~/spring, but configs should be in ~/.config/spring probably
is ~ userland?

what about spring games that have different spring settings? what about multiple engine version installs? Seems short sighted.
Engine is technically content and should be in ~/spring/engines
Config belongs to ~/.config/spring or ~/.config/ as I said.
Nothing prevents you from having multiple configs for different games/engine versions in ~/.config/spring, i.e. ~/.config/spring/engine91.0 (folder or file), or ~/.config/zero-k
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