Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Discuss your problems with the latest release of the engine here. Problems with games, maps or other utilities belong in their respective forums.

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Jazcash
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Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Jazcash »

About two weeks ago I put a notepad next to my computer for the purpose of writing down something noteworthy about Spring every time I thought about it. Some are bugs, some are just suggestions. This is not an engine, lobby, map or game specific thread. It's just a general report. I should probably put some of these on Mantis but hey, Help & Bugs forum is here so might as well use it :P Also note that some of these may also just be issues with me, not for everybody. Oh and I've only played BA so some of these issues may not occur in other games.

-------------------------------------------------------------

#1: Egde of map is sometimes buggy
Every so often, building units at the edge of the map or issuing commands there screws up. Instead, the action/buildframe flickers when you're hovering over the edge of the map area and does nothing when you actually issue the command. If nobody else has this problem, I'll try and get a small video or something to demonstrate.

#2: Slow reconnection
In the past, I used to be able to catch up to games really quickly. I could barely move the camera or anything while it happened but it caught up a lot lot faster. Now when reconnecting to a game, it goes at a much slower pace and gives me a lot higher fps rate. My PC is perfectly capable of rejoining a game at high speeds, yet, it took me 25 minutes to join a 40 minute game. It almost felt like it was going at the exact same speed when rejoining. Instead, I'd much rather have very little fps and catch up with the current frame much faster. Hell, I'd prefer a black screen if it made it even faster.


#3: Alt Tab bug
This has been around ever since the day I started playing. That's well over 4 years ago now. When you alt tab out of Spring and alt tab back in, stuff doesn't work properly until you press the alt key once more ingame. I know it isn't just me that has this issue.

#4: Pathing
Nothing much to say here. It's just terrible in many ways. If you'd like me to go into more detail on this, I'll make a separate thread because this is probably the biggest issue in this list. It's also probably responsible for many other bugs that people assume are different issues to pathing.

#5: TASClient minimaps
Sometimes TASClient minimaps are black. Nothing can really be done about this unless Satirik fixes it I suppose.

#6: Switching factions with initial queue
I think it'd be nice if initial queue switched faction according to the faction picked ingame. Initial queue made sense in this aspect before ingame faction switching became a thing.

#7: Crash every now and then when Spring is launched
This is just a bug on my end, not quite sure what causes it. This is kind of useless to anybody tbh. I'll try and remember to fetch an infolog and edit this thread and shove it right here -> Here I am! <- next time it happens.

#8: Optional email field for server accounts
You guys should know I want this by now. I've been banging on about it for years. I just saw people were discussing this lately in a minutes meeting I believe. Just thought I'd say this is seriously needed and I see absolutely no reason at all why not to include this. I keep seeing people in the lobby who've lost their accounts and had to start new ones. Mainly players who've been gone a long time.

#9: Ingame unready button
Simple as really. People shouldn't have to reconnect to a game just because they misplaced their spawn position.

#10: Unloading units is a bit dodgy
Sometimes, issuing an order for a transport to unload a unit in a certain position, it doesn't work and nothing happens at all. The transport does even attempt to unload. This might be a pathing related issue, not sure.

#11: SpringFiles searching sucks
It always has done. I'm not sure what the exact problem is, I just know it doesn't always behave as it should. Also, autohosts don't always fetch a decent link for certain maps. Vbs thinks this could just be an issue with maps that have spaces in the names. Here's an example:

* Spads2 * Map link: http://spring.jobjol.nl/search_result.p ... select_all (Link that autohost gave)

No map there apparently. However, when searching "Aquarius Crossing" with spacing on SpringFiles it pops up straight away: http://springfiles.com/finder/1/Aquarius

#12: Rotating camera on maps so you can play them at different rotations
This was just a suggestion that somebody made in a game just now. I've always thought this'd be a neat thing but I can't remember ever seeing anything that did the job. Forgive me if I'm mistaken and there is actually a widget out there that does this, I've just never seen it.
In my own opinion though, this should be behaviour built into the engine.

#13: Widget to show nano ranges
Or perhaps include it in one of the current UnitRanges/DefenseRanges widget? I'd just like to see the range of my nanos at any time, not just when I'm placing them.

#14: F2 heightmaps now don't really serve much help
They seem to show red, even in areas which certain units can cross. Only in the very darkest shades of red are unpassable areas but it's very hard to distinguish between them. It makes playing on new maps a very difficult when the surface isn't so obvious.

#15: Lag
Seem to be getting some delay in some games. At first I thought it was me but turns out everybody is getting it. Game just freezes completely for 2-4 seconds and then continues as usual afterwards. Might just be a specific autohost (an [x] one I think), but don't hold me to that.

#16: Multiple map/game directories
So now we have a Games folder generated by the installed as well as a mods folder? It was bad enough having all the folders replicated in Documents/My Games/Spring, now it's even more confusing.
Just one folder for each in one place should be all that's needed. Atm I have certain games and maps split across two different places, and it's not my fault either. Perhaps implement some sort script into ArchiveMover.exe to shift everything into the right folders and delete the useless empty ones?

#17: Bouncy units
This might be related to pathing too, but I'm unsure. Currently if a unit gets stuck or wedged between some other units it either gets jammed or it spazes out and bounces all over the place. Units seem to be getting jammed a lot easier too, I think I can safely put that bit down to pathing.

#18: F3 has some weird behaviour?
I have no idea what F3 currently does. If I were to guess, I'd say it could be just centring the camera on the last position any player has had their cursor, issued a command or drawn something. But I really have no idea.

#19: Initial Queue should show the metal map when placing mexes
That says it really. Would be nice to have F4 view shown when placing mexes with initial queue, just like what happens once the game starts.

#20: Nixers don't always fire
This is just a BA one, obviously. They've been this way for some time.

-------------------------------------------------------------

That's all I can think of for now. If I come up with more, I'll append them to my list. Also feel free to share some bugs/suggestions of your own or just be helpful and state whether you also experience anything in my list so devs and people can be sure it's just just an issue with my setup.

Also, this isn't a thread ranting at people to fix things. I just want to make sure the right people are aware these issues exist. Thanks.
Last edited by Jazcash on 05 Apr 2012, 03:15, edited 2 times in total.
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CarRepairer
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by CarRepairer »

#12 - COFC. It's in zk and evo. It has all sorts of features beyond just rotation.
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Jazcash
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Jazcash »

CarRepairer wrote:It has all sorts of features beyond just rotation.
Which is exactly why I don't use it. I either end up doing things I don't want to because I don't know the keybinds for it or I just make a mistake and hit a key by mistake and suddenly the camera is completely different. Should be engine behaviour.
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Beherith
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Beherith »

If an old timer comes back and does a random forum rant, does it still have any effect?

But let me go point by point:
1. Just recently noticed this one (a couple of hours ago) ill investigate
2. ZK reconnects slow as hell. MT BA reconnects at same rate as normal BA but retains good fps throughout. IMO reconnect is none slower than it was. Skewed perception on your side.
3. I have no such bug, have you tried mantis? Seeing as that is how we report bugs, not through forum baaaw threads.
4. Agreed, quite bad.
5. Its a bug related to update of devil.dll (3rd party, my fault) satirik will fix when good and ready.
6. Initial queue just got added, we are working on seamless integration. You are welcome to test and code.
7. Infolog or it didnt happen (seriously, also MANTIS IT, or else its needless baaw again)
8. Would be nice, though moderators will reset a lost account password if asked.
9. More abuse potential than use. If you are ready, you are ready. Dont click it unless you are, ready is final (be thankful for the rest of the players waiting if you instead decide to try the reconnect workaround)
10. Yeah, noticed it, unsure why, though line unload is still the most reliable.
11. Always been, but I recommend you enable Rapid in tasclient. Its a world of difference (clickless map downloading)
12. Disorienting, pointless, enough maps without this false inflation. Remember mapoptions? How all forumgoers clamored for it, yet never once have I seen it used?
13. Hold shift while placing building. I hate main gui clutter - so always on nano ranges wont be a part of BA while I'm around.
14. Temp engine bug, its still way better than before.
15. Purely servers or your isp's fault. I have 0 lag issues since I have proper internet.
16. Mods are deprecated, but support as legacy for a while. Use portable if you dont want a my games/spring folder.
17. Yep, pathing related.
18. F3 is bugged atm, but should be better next release.

19. How are the BAR missions going?
20. Feel like doing some informative BA load screens for newbies?
abma
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by abma »

its hard to take something useful out of such a list, mostly because for most points information is missing.


1. please post at mantis + add screenshot / video
2. thats a feature request i guess, https://github.com/spring/spring/commit ... 1cb39cc838
"reconnectSimDrawBalance" needs to be configureable
3. http://springrts.com/mantis/view.php?id=2904
4. thats way to unspecific. please give an example what doesn't work.
5. thats a tasclient bug. for which map does this happen? i didn't see this issue on api.springfiles.com, so i'm sure its tasclient only.
6. game/widget issue
7. more info needed, useless until you supply infolog.txt
8. WIP, follow the lobby dev meeting minutes
9. afaik game issue, ask / complain BA devs
10. replay / exact instructions needed
11. spads should use http://api.springfiles.com/xmlrpc.php, i already told vbs that, but it was ignored.
12. thats a feature request
13. feature request, too (there should be already such a widget somewhere, as "ranges" of many other things can be shown too)
14. http://springrts.com/mantis/view.php?id=3051
15. thats to unspecific, i didn't have such problems when speccing
16. you've to clean up it yourself. Mods is deprecated, move all files to the Games subfolder. Also you can move all maps/games to your home folder. ArchiveMover is deprecated and already removed from the spring installer. Download by Lobby is the way to go.
17. duplicate of #4 i seems
18. afaik it jumps to positions where markers where placed last.
19. thats a widget bug/feature request
20. report to the BA devs

this list is very confusing :-/

please in the future: one thread for one issue and use mantis if you really found a bug.
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Floris
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Floris »

13. -> hover with mouse over nano and press shift
15. when somebody shares large amounts of units the game sometimes freezes for a few secs
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Forboding Angel »

Jaz, can you please play an evo game vs the survival AI (built in... think chickens but with normal units), and edit your list as appropriate?

Many of these points are related specifically to ZK and BA. However, instead of just saying on point #x "Yer rong, podner." I'd much prefer if you experienced it yourself and see if you draw any different conclusions.

You don't have to, but It would be nifty.

http://www.desura.com/games/evolution-rts/play
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Jazcash
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Jazcash »

Beherith wrote:If an old timer comes back and does a random forum rant, does it still have any effect?
This is not a rant, this is not a baww. This is just an easy way for me to get everything out there instead of spamming threads or mantis reports. Also, as I stated in the first paragraph, I will put some of these on Mantis. It feels as if you haven't read my post fully, you reiterated a lot of what I explained. Sorry if you did, it just doesn't seem that way.
2. ZK reconnects slow as hell. MT BA reconnects at same rate as normal BA but retains good fps throughout. IMO reconnect is none slower than it was. Skewed perception on your side.
Well I believe it could be made faster then, a lot faster.
3. I have no such bug, have you tried mantis? Seeing as that is how we report bugs, not through forum baaaw threads.
I can be sure this bug exists with others too. I've spoken with many others about it over the years and I've had the issue on two different PCs. It's probably worth saying that this doesn't always happen, but most of the time when you tab back in. Could be an ATI thing as both my PCs have used ATI cards.
8. Would be nice, though moderators will reset a lost account password if asked.
A) Some players that lose their account don't even know Spring even has moderators. That's how little moderators actually spend time playing BA. And B) Sometimes the issue is lost username too. In fact, it's probably that more than a lost password. And that's usually something moderators can't help with.
9. More abuse potential than use. If you are ready, you are ready. Dont click it unless you are, ready is final (be thankful for the rest of the players waiting if you instead decide to try the reconnect workaround)
Think I probably agree with this actually. Still, surely there's something more graceful than reconnecting if somebody misplaces their spawn.
12. Disorienting, pointless, enough maps without this false inflation. Remember mapoptions? How all forumgoers clamored for it, yet never once have I seen it used?
This has nothing to do with mapoptions and I can't see how it's related in any way at all.
13. Hold shift while placing building. I hate main gui clutter - so always on nano ranges wont be a part of BA while I'm around.
As I said, I want a way to be able to see the ranges other than when placing them.
19. How are the BAR missions going?
20. Feel like doing some informative BA load screens for newbies?
Probably shouldn't have used those numbers as I said I'm going to be appending things as I already did. I'm waiting for BAR to be released first ;) If there's a pre-release around anywhere, I won't use that either because there's a chance things will be majorly changed when it's actually released which would render all the missions borked. As for the loadscreens, you mean like Machio's old loadscreens for CA? I think those were pretty decent, although I'm not sure if that's the kind of thing you're after. I still think it'd be best to develop some kind of helper/tip widget ingame that pops up when relevant. I think ZK has this sort of thing?
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Jazcash
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Jazcash »

Floris wrote:13. -> hover with mouse over nano and press shift
15. when somebody shares large amounts of units the game sometimes freezes for a few secs
Thanks for 13, I knew there was a way but I totally forgot <3

For 15, that isn't the problem. I'm fairly sure now that it IS the [x]TheHost2 autohost.
Forboding Angel wrote:Jaz, can you please play an evo game vs the survival AI (built in... think chickens but with normal units), and edit your list as appropriate?

Many of these points are related specifically to ZK and BA. However, instead of just saying on point #x "Yer rong, podner." I'd much prefer if you experienced it yourself and see if you draw any different conclusions.

You don't have to, but It would be nifty.

http://www.desura.com/games/evolution-rts/play
Sure, I'll give it a go :-) Edit: Ugh, it's about a gig. Sorry, I'll do it when I get back to uni, my internet here at home is awful. Would take me a good number of hours to dl that. Might leave it on overnight actually.

I'll help with bugs as much as I can. I'll also do proper reports on Mantis when I get time. I just wanted to sum everything up first and get other people's opinions on certain things.
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MiNiMi
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by MiNiMi »

#1 is pretty annoying if u play @Edge

here is the requested Vid

http://www.youtube.com/embed/NChg5l-RAos
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Jazcash
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Jazcash »

MiNiMi wrote:#1 is pretty annoying if u play @Edge

here is the requested Vid

http://www.youtube.com/embed/NChg5l-RAos
This. You saved me effort and time. Have one of my plus ones. +1

Also, managed to get an infolog for the issue with crashing. Here it is.
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CarRepairer
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by CarRepairer »

Jazcash wrote:
CarRepairer wrote:It has all sorts of features beyond just rotation.
Which is exactly why I don't use it. I either end up doing things I don't want to because I don't know the keybinds for it or I just make a mistake and hit a key by mistake and suddenly the camera is completely different. Should be engine behaviour.
I spent countless hours replicating the TA cam. The wheel and middle click are all the same. Why don't you give me some concrete examples of what problems you've had?
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knorke
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by knorke »

Jazcash wrote:I just want to make sure the right people are aware these issues exist.
Does not work this way..
Your points are about engine, BA, widgets, autohosts, server, lobby and more things and it is all done by different people. I guess it is in good intent but a giant list like this is useless.
To make sure the right people are adressed, use bugtracker or make seperate threads in appropriate forum, nobody will mind about spam.
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very_bad_soldier
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by very_bad_soldier »

abma wrote: 11. spads should use http://api.springfiles.com/xmlrpc.php, i already told vbs that, but it was ignored.
Wait, what? I am aware you pointed to that URL in another context related to another problem (tbh I dont know anymore what it was about).
How could I modify SPADS to use another search method?
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Beherith
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Beherith »

Also, as I stated in the first paragraph, I will put some of these on Mantis.
!=
I should probably put some of these on Mantis but hey, Help & Bugs forum is here so might as well use it :P
Sorry if I misinterpreted it.

The alt tab bug is ATI, imo. Have you tried windowed fullscreen?
http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewtopic.p ... fullscreen

Code: Select all

springsettings.cfg wrote:
Fullscreen = 0
WindowPosX = 0
WindowPosY = 0
WindowState = 0
XResolution = 0
YResolution = 0
WindowBorderless = 1
Think I probably agree with this actually. Still, surely there's something more graceful than reconnecting if somebody misplaces their spawn.
Is a contradiction. People should appreciate that you can use a feature of spring to achieve this. Rejoin is a valid way - sure there are more elegant things, but its nice nontheless

Regarding the missions:
We wish to release the missions with BAR. There will not be any significant changes that could affect any mission is a way as to break it. If it by chance does, you have my word that I will do my best to fix it and help. Also, if you provide rough heightmap sketches (mostly with passability types marked) and a climate you wish, I can get started on making maps for your missions immediately.
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very_bad_soldier
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by very_bad_soldier »

Beherith wrote: The alt tab bug is ATI, imo. Have you tried windowed fullscreen?
I have an NVIDIA GPU since years but also suffer since years from this bug :(
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Jools
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Jools »

#21: Water is not properly supported

This bug has been around since Mr Hedenhös. Essentially, water is treated as land by the engine. When you shoot something at it, it looks and sounds exactly as if you were shooting at land. The reason is that at some point, the engine stopped supporting the "soundwater"-tag in weapons.tdf and as far as I know, there is no replacement.

See this thread for more information: http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1821

See this video for an example:
http://youtu.be/ij7XQghlbeg
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Jazcash
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Jazcash »

Beherith wrote: Regarding the missions:
We wish to release the missions with BAR. There will not be any significant changes that could affect any mission is a way as to break it. If it by chance does, you have my word that I will do my best to fix it and help. Also, if you provide rough heightmap sketches (mostly with passability types marked) and a climate you wish, I can get started on making maps for your missions immediately.
Alright, I'm gonna start with some brainstorming, designs and ideas first. Is there a specific place you want me to put this stuff or should I just post it in the BA forum? I want some way for people to respond so I can get some feedback or better ideas from others.
Jools wrote:#21: Water is not properly supported

This bug has been around since Mr Hedenhös. Essentially, water is treated as land by the engine. When you shoot something at it, it looks and sounds exactly as if you were shooting at land. The reason is that at some point, the engine stopped supporting the "soundwater"-tag in weapons.tdf and as far as I know, there is no replacement.

See this thread for more information: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1821

See this video for an example:
http://youtu.be/ij7XQghlbeg
I'm not very clued up on how the engine treats water, but I guess you're right. Getting that soundwater tag back and having a splish splash splosh sound or two would be pretty neat. Also, in regards to water, I see units now sort of slide/glide a little when they stop. Is this intentional behaviour? I think it looks kinda neat but sometimes it makes units accidentally drift into enemy range or just into a cliff or something and they get stuck :?
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Cheesecan
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by Cheesecan »

How about the bug where when after you press F11 twice the keyboard scroll speed while shift is held down decreases for a while then comes back to normal.

One of those little eccentricities of spring that makes you love it even more..
zerver
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Re: Jaz's massive list of general bugs and areas for improvement

Post by zerver »

Beherith wrote: 2. ZK reconnects slow as hell. MT BA reconnects at same rate as normal BA but retains good fps throughout. IMO reconnect is none slower than it was. Skewed perception on your side.
There is some new feature for ST spring that allows you to choose how much FPS you want during reconnect. I do not know the details, but if you have more than the good old 2FPS during reconnect, this is probably the reason. jK knows the full story.
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