Threads

[manored]

Lolz.You cant be a pedophile and not rape...isnt that obvious?i mean can an adult and a child have a normal relationship lolz? u crazy?
imagine a man who is attracted to women but cant have sex with them ever..Itsanintersting subject...not thepedophilia but the gay issue.
Psychiatry aannounced homosexuality as rooted in the genes but done so after tremendeous pressure from gay groups..

I used the word "atracted" for a reason. What I mean is that having a genetic problem making someone be atracted by children is not enough to make a pedophilie, because he also needs to have the psychologic problems that will cause him to act him a way he knows that is extremelly harmfull for another human being just because he wants. Therefore, I do believe that pedophilie should be treated as a psychologic problem.

Example to make things clearer: We all fell extreme will to kill somebody at some point in our life, but we dont do so because we dont have the mentioned psychologic problems :)

[Gota]

You dont get it do you...i find these forums to be a bigger and bigger waste of time....the problem of a pedophile is not that he isa rapist its that he is atttracted to kids..rape is just his resort cause he cant stop himself after x amount of time..thats what im guessing..as i said imagine u couldnt satisfy yuor sexua lneedz ever...youd feel frustrated beleive me...
pedophilia is not the issue i was just wondering how its different from being gay or straight in the way it works.

[SwiftSpear]

You dont get it do you...i find these forums to be a bigger and bigger waste of time....the problem of a pedophile is not that he isa rapist its that he is atttracted to kids..rape is just his resort cause he cant stop himself after x amount of time..thats what im guessing..as i said imagine u couldnt satisfy yuor sexua lneedz ever...youd feel frustrated beleive me...
pedophilia is not the issue i was just wondering how its different from being gay or straight in the way it works.

Raping kids is bad. End of story.

[Elkvis]

You dont get it do you...i find these forums to be a bigger and bigger waste of time....the problem of a pedophile is not that he isa rapist its that he is atttracted to kids..rape is just his resort cause he cant stop himself after x amount of time..thats what im guessing..as i said imagine u couldnt satisfy yuor sexua lneedz ever...youd feel frustrated beleive me...
pedophilia is not the issue i was just wondering how its different from being gay or straight in the way it works.

Good question. I believe it probably has not be answered scientifically, but I'll hazard a guess.

In an evolutionary context it is valuable for people to find children attractive and cute (non-sexual connotation). It is the manifestation of our protective mechanism and is very valuable in a tribal context.

So, the issue is that in some people this protective reflex is turned right up to the point where simply liking children or having a general admiration becomes 'sexual desire' or the desire to form a close adult relationship.

Manored is right too. A person can have this desire all along and never act on it. One would need to be truly uninhibited from basic morals to self-justify a movement on said desire


Compare this to sexuality. Sexuality is not related to this process. It is something entirely different. The evolutionary process underlying it is largely unknown. Perhaps it has spawned from a similar 'turning up' of the instincts that drive men into groups for hunting... (and drinking).


So, to summarise. It is entirely possible that paedophilia and homosexuality are born from the same genetic process. Defective hard-wiring, putting a behaviour in overdrive. But, they are different in where they form and which hard-wired tribal behaviour they effect. They are not the only examples of this process either.

So, to call one a psychiatric issue and other is not strictly correct But; I would argue that genetics, neurology and the human psyche is a land of greys. This is no place of neo-conservative flexibilities.

[Gota]

hmm interesting.

[Teutooni]

Manored is right too. A person can have this desire all along and never act on it. One would need to be truly uninhibited from basic morals to self-justify a movement on said desire

As far as I know, mental patients don't refrain themselves because they see no reason to do so. They are totally oblivious to how normal people percieve the world.

[Panda]

You dont get it do you...i find these forums to be a bigger and bigger waste of time....the problem of a pedophile is not that he isa rapist its that he is atttracted to kids..

A pedophile is a rapist, because having sex with, or raping, kids is wrong. Having sex with kids is wrong because it's a kid and is very immature, physically and mentally.

rape is just his resort cause he cant stop himself after x amount of time..thats what im guessing..as i said imagine u couldnt satisfy yuor sexua lneedz ever...youd feel frustrated beleive me...

He can stop himself if he trains himself to not be attracted to children the same way a priest would train himself to not be attracted to women or a nun not to be attracted to men. He could focus on God or something that does not involve children, work at doing this all the time, and go to therapy to try and gain a more realistic view of how children are immature. Unfortunately, I doubt that a lot of pedophiles do this and genetic predispositions towards certain behaviors is just that, a predisposition. It isn't so strong that they have to be a pedophile.

pedophilia is not the issue i was just wondering how its different from being gay or straight in the way it works.

Pedophilia different from being gay or straight in the way it works because it involves being attracted to children and having a mental disorder that involves the pedophile thinking that it's ok to rape children and that there is nothing wrong with raping children, as if it were right to rape anyone, much less a child.

Also, homosexuality used to encouraged in Rome among soldiers when they went off to war.

[tombom]

A pedophile is only a rapist if he acts on his desires.

[Gota]

I dont think rapists think tha traping is good..they just cant stop themselves..isnt thta true?
Anyway if u say u can cure a pedophile with a shrink than can u do the same with a gay person?

[Snipawolf]

It's all about willpower. If you have the mental fortitude to stop yourself from raping a kid, you'll be fine. When you open a crack in your defenses, such as an excuse or lying so much you believe it, you shatter your defenses. It's kinda like Prince Rupert's Drops... You can't shatter the head, even with a hammer, yet you harm the fragile tail, and it shatters with force.

[Gota]

I was talking about the dsire itslef.
IOsnt it too mcu to aks a person to overcome his sexual drive and when not being able to judge him?could you me or any other guy not have sex with women for our entire lives?maybe but we dont know that..its a very hard question i think...
So question is are they to be blamed for not being able to overcome their sexual drive or are they to be looked at as mentaliiy ill and thus not responsible for their actions.. raping a child is a horrible thing that plays on our emotions but when we talk of justice and science we cannot lean on our emotional response.
so again comes the question of whether sexual attraction is genetic or not..if it is not than gay peopel can be cured of feeling attracted to same sex partners...and so can pedophiles of feeling attracted to children...if not as the gay community says than are pedophiles to be treated to as regular human beings even though they are required to withstand harsh conditions and are not responsible for beign born with a bad gene pool and should we create some special way to deal with this phenomenon in which the culprits are actually victims themselves.

[Elkvis]

You dont get it do you...i find these forums to be a bigger and bigger waste of time....the problem of a pedophile is not that he isa rapist its that he is atttracted to kids..

A pedophile is a rapist, because having sex with, or raping, kids is wrong. Having sex with kids is wrong because it's a kid and is very immature, physically and mentally.

No, a paedophile is someone sexually attracted to kids. It not until they act on the impulse that they become a rapist.

rape is just his resort cause he cant stop himself after x amount of time..thats what im guessing..as i said imagine u couldnt satisfy yuor sexua lneedz ever...youd feel frustrated beleive me...

He can stop himself if he trains himself to not be attracted to children the same way a priest would train himself to not be attracted to women or a nun not to be attracted to men. He could focus on God or something that does not involve children, work at doing this all the time, and go to therapy to try and gain a more realistic view of how children are immature. Unfortunately, I doubt that a lot of pedophiles do this and genetic predispositions towards certain behaviors is just that, a predisposition. It isn't so strong that they have to be a pedophile.

That is the single most stupid thing I have heard ever. I'll bet that priests are the most sexually frustrated people on the planet. baring the fact that you can bet they all fuck each other.

Also, homosexuality used to encouraged in Rome among soldiers when they went off to war.

That would have been so hot.

I was talking about the dsire itslef.
IOsnt it too mcu to aks a person to overcome his sexual drive and when not being able to judge him?could you me or any other guy not have sex with women for our entire lives?maybe but we dont know that..its a very hard question i think...

Ok, try it yourself. Pick the opposite of your sexuality and force yourself to be it. I've tried it, it was sole destroying. Ignorant fundamentalist Christians do a serious amount of psychological damage to themselves by following this argument.

I imagine paedophilia is the same. While I would argue its from a different process, it is for all intents a and purposes sexuality.

They tried to cure sex criminals once, by having the person associate their particular sexual deviancy with pain. They subjected the criminals to electric shock therapy while showing them pictures they would find erotic. The program was realised to be a failure when the researchers realised that their subjects were putting their hands in the toaster to get off.

So question is are they to be blamed for not being able to overcome their sexual drive or are they to be looked at as mentaliiy ill and thus not responsible for their actions.. raping a child is a horrible thing that plays on our emotions but when we talk of justice and science we cannot lean on our emotional response.

Are we to be blamed for fearing the idea so much that we force paedophile to keep their dirty secret to themselves, to struggle against their desires alone?

I like where you are going. in general. But I cant put a consistent argument together either way. The whole situation is an awful moral and practical dilemma.

[Sleksa]

Also, homosexuality used to encouraged in Rome among soldiers when they went off to war.

I'd love to hear the source for this information

[Machiosabre]

Roman Rainbow Magazine

[Michilus_nimbus]

They were also payed with salt and put fermented fish guts on everything they ate. And put sea water in their wine.

[Panda]

This thread seems like, along with the help of Wikipedia, it has all the necessary information needed to form educated opinions on these subjects, but it appears to have degenerated, oh well.

[rattle]

Actually this thread is about ideas for threads, not discussing them here. Thus this thread has already degenerated...

durr

[manored]

At this point I would like to add that nothing is fault of anybody, casuality formed our personality... therefore, regardeless of the problem being psychologic or not the individuals have to be treated in some manner or excluded from the society.

[Forboding Angel]

I think elkvis and gota are making some quite good points.

If being a pedo is psychological, then how is being gay natural?

What about beastiality?

Just because it's psychological doesn't mean it's bad, even though in many cases it turns out that way.

So by the same logic, someone could train themselves to not be sexually attracted to dogs, children, and other men.

That logic doesn't compute.

Let me point out here that I don't have a problem with gays. They do their thing and I do mine, more power to 'em.

If a man and a man can have a healthy relationship without rape, could not the same be said for an adult and a child (and by child I mean a kid that has just hit puberty)? Beasts don't really come into play here as they can't technically be shown to have an opinion.

One particular note about women and dogs/etc. The dog doesn't really know, or for that matter even care, to them it's mating, therefore, why is it considered wrong?

There, devil's advocate has been played.

[Peet]

If a man and a man can have a healthy relationship without rape, could not the same be said for an adult and a child (and by child I mean a kid that has just hit puberty)?

The whole point of the illegality of relations between adults and children is that, legally and realistically, minors are not yet capable of making a sound decision on that sort of matter - thus valid consent cannot be made.
The only thing "wrong" with homosexuality is that it controverts the basic biological imperatives of reproduction.

The two are apples and oranges; you cannot declare that one must be legal because of the legality of the other.

One particular note about women and dogs/etc. The dog doesn't really know, or for that matter even care, to them it's mating, therefore, why is it considered wrong?

Well, in some cases beastiality could consist of animal cruelty; in other cases it could cause injury for either man or beast. I have read that many STDs originated in animals.
Personally, I think it's the "eew" factor.