Spring:Total War - Page 2

Spring:Total War

Various things about Spring that do not fit in any of the other forums listed below, including forum rules.

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chillaaa
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Post by chillaaa » 05 May 2005, 00:12

In regards to using units from previous sector, could a system not be put in place that when you go on to the next sector before the map loads you are presented with a screen showing the troops you ended with. You the have a "points" total with equals say 40 - 60% of your total amount of troops (the rest are "garrsioned" on the previous sector) and you then choose what you bring with you. Obviously then the higher tech level units cost more "points". It may be another crazy balancing issue but from games such as TWetc that ive seen (and im not a real fan of them) the army selection screen would to me be a good way to move on to the next sector with reinforcements.
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Zoombie
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Post by Zoombie » 05 May 2005, 00:47

Okay here is how to play MY game for...... Galactic Conquest


It starts like a MMORPG, as players choose their sides (COre and ARM) and then their comanders (Space and Land). By the was Zwzsg i also love TAFF as do all my freinds. So lets say you chose a Core spac comander, then you start in this HUGE HUGE HUUUUUUUUGE galactic map, with stars, planets nebuli, the whol shebang!

Then you would chose a freindly planent to chat with frinds, play mock battles and in general screw around. You can 'settle' planets that are nutral and build bases. However space comanders are AS important as land comanders becasue the only way for a landcomander to get to a nutral or contessed, or enemy planet is too hitch a ride with a space comander. So space comanders are fleet admirals, blockade runners and plainitary dominators. They engage other fleets, break through blockades (whitch stop galactic gates) and in general shell and bomb planets.

Land comanders are plannetfallers, borders, and generals. They ride fire onto a planets surface in a space assult. They bord enemy starships (whitch are BIIIIIIIIGGGGG) and lead assults on other bases.

Now to get back to the original topic.

A space comander (Fred) and two land comanders (Willma and Shuan) all get togetger to take over a contesseded planet of Epsilon Eridani, Epsilon Eridani II. There is a light enemy fleet in the area, but it is building fast. Fred begins to build up a force and attacks the orbital defences around the planet. He manages to get his dropship close enough to the planet to unlode the two comanders onto the surface. The comanders begin to fight for the three sections of the planet (each one is a map). Two are nutral but one is a hevely defended area. Menhile in orbit a huge space battle has broken out as the ships brodside, flank and in general carry on cranky. Any large ship thats destroyed around the planet would slowlwy fly into it, and with no atmo to burn it up would provide a interesting suprise to the ground figheres. A Planetkiller smashies into the middle of the enemy territoy and they begin to repair it. Shuan attacks, hoping to savage it for her side. Fred launches an all out navel attack from one of the major ociens on the plannet. Willma hits the enemy comander vessal and he die's. The orbit is secure, giving Willma, Fred and Shuan a huge advantage. Surrounded and pounded, the last enemy territory falls in a massive struggle!

Cool eh??

So their are two game's going on at the same time. Theri are litteraly hundreads of individual real time battles, and every five minuts (or more) a turn gose by in the galxy map. The real time battles are considered to be going at a accelerated pace, and can go on simultanuously along witht eh galixy turns. Every turn a comander at a home planet can either A whatch one of the hundreads of battles, B manage a planets econamy by allocating metal and energy to Infustructure, Resherch and Units. Infustructure gives you more energy, metal and defences. Resherech improves your nano abilitys and units. Also as the Yankspankers create more and more new units (righttttt) they cna be unlocked through resherch. Units builds base army templates, whitch you can make. Example: Ten platoons of Pewee's and Five Platoons of Hammers could be called Light Infantry Army (LIA division 1) Theses can be deployed for sudden engagements where you dont have the time to build bases. Each turn something hapens. Also you can talk to other players if your bored.

This would be called Galactic Conquest see!
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zwzsg
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Post by zwzsg » 05 May 2005, 01:30

Zoombie wrote:Theri are litteraly hundreads of individual real time battles
Currently six games going on. But Spring is pretty new. Will it ever rise to hundreds of game at once?
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Zoombie
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Post by Zoombie » 05 May 2005, 01:53

probly. I sent an Email to my long time most favoret magasine Pc Gamer (whooooo!). They put TA as the 35th best game of ALL TIME. Its an honer to even be ON the list in the first place, let alone 35 out of fifty. So i hope they get the mail and try out the game
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Warlord Zsinj
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Post by Warlord Zsinj » 05 May 2005, 11:06

I don't know, my solution seems to be more closely revolving around the original Galactic War layout. The major differences occur within Spring, rather than in the macroworld of the GW. The only major difference being that planets have several adjoining sectors on them.

Which is not to say that my idea is any better or worse than anyone elses, just that it is probably more feasible.
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AF
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Post by AF » 05 May 2005, 18:29

I'm thinking now that 2 seperate forks are needed, the space battle type and the original type.
I'm thinking that the space battle would need a few changes tot he engine, especialy to allow new players to barge into a game, and for the addition fo huge thigns lie planet and maps that ahve no heightmap but go on endlessly, aswell as allowing starships to warp to other starsystems for a sense of scale, for balance however ships would ahve to be larger and the shiyards larger too and thus ships take a lot longer to build, more like half an hour at least thus you dont end up swarming the univers with million of ships on the first day.

Also some sort of economic system would be needed, such as energy and metal being given a monetary value and so would shis and bases be thus you could sell your empire and become a wealthy rogue agent,.

I'd also say that people could create their own races by subitting their new untis and weaponry to a group that controls submissions in the interests of keeping the game balanced.
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Tsumari
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Post by Tsumari » 05 May 2005, 21:15

Zoombie wrote:probly. I sent an Email to my long time most favoret magasine Pc Gamer (whooooo!). They put TA as the 35th best game of ALL TIME. Its an honer to even be ON the list in the first place, let alone 35 out of fifty. So i hope they get the mail and try out the game
PC Gamer's reader poll actually rated TA as the single greatest game of all time =) Annihilated.com and TAU pumped letters and votes in.

Tsumari
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Daniel
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Post by Daniel » 13 May 2005, 17:57

the problem with all these great ideas is........

the amount of people playing this game in the first place, if only a few people play, it aint gonna mount up to much.

my coputer doesnt support TA Spring......... yeah all feel sorry for me........ but i was wondering if the same principle could be used for OTA and its mods........ like the origonal sectors of PW with more maps per planet and space maps inbetween planets and so on..... but as i know its up to dange to do all of these things.

great ideas by the way, keep em coming :lol:
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Kixxe
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Post by Kixxe » 01 Jun 2005, 22:51

These ideas sound BIG but fun....
I think that evry side of the ''map'' should have an ''exit'' Example.
I am at ''planet 1'' A nice woddy planet whit my arm freinds. Me and a buddy are building upp spaceships to assult the core force on ''planet2''
We build massive starfeelets and ground troops, and goes to the upper corner of the map. Then, we click the ''exit'' (gate, big exit sign, arm sybmbol, giant marhemllow whatever.) and the game is saved, and all the troups seletd are transferd into a space map whit astroids and stuff. We assult the enemy, kills their defences (in space) and clicks the next Exit. under this time we also bomb the enemy, who loses some of it's defences. (mostly all their mines and some off the defens near the landing site. All our fleets are on ''planet2'' and we start buildng a base. but the enemy upon us, are defences start to fall. my buddy and me builds some fast Startionary defences and leves the area (pushing the exit), Taking almost all our mobile units whit us. My buddy goes down to ''planet1'' and i stay in space to build defences.

And so on.

Since im in a creative mode, here a Diagram.
Gray: core Green: Arm Blue: neutral
each sqware is one zone. on ecah edge of the zone there are an exit to the then zone next to it. Planets have 2 zones (at least) one when your over the planet and choosing the location or (maybe?) giving some cover fire or bombing the hell out of their defenses which uses energy. and one (or more) when you land, whit all your units and things. Energy and metal stays in a zone if not transported some way.
( more planets and space between in the ''real'' game)
Image
The game should be like a shared commander game in the beging. about 4 commanders who are shared bye 3 diffrent players for each commander start at the same ''planet'' and then expand. And when one side reaches the other sides home planet, that side loses and the game respawns after 24 hours. (or less)

IF we (we? or they? who is gonna make all this? Anyway) suced on setting 2 areas together, we can do some cool stuff to! we can take 6 or more and link em together to a whole round (round and roudn-.-)planet!!
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[K.B.] Napalm Cobra
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Post by [K.B.] Napalm Cobra » 01 Jun 2005, 23:21

We'll need about 4 maps per planet.
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Zoombie
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Post by Zoombie » 02 Jun 2005, 01:29

I had a thought. Their could be a city building aspect to all this where you give some one terrain modifying tools and say "Have fun!" Then you can build massive citys, protected by huge fortresses. Then the enemy can have just as much fun blowing it to hell with orbital bombardment and sending in landing squads. Then the city would become its own huge battle ground. See i alway's thought that a true "city fight" feel was missing from OTA, even on maps with citys! You know, gurrila actions, snipers, useing the sweres to sneak around, and various other cool things. So three battles can be going on at the same time, with several people battling over a major city, while others are harrying each other in the open plains and all of theses guy's are hopeing that their starfareing bretheren are not getting blown out of the sky. Cuase space is the ultimiate high ground....



PS how the hell do you add those spiftacular diagrames?
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Warlord Zsinj
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Post by Warlord Zsinj » 02 Jun 2005, 03:49

I envisioned it being something more akin to this (appologies for the large picture):

Image

Note the gaps between the maps. This means that each map doesn't have to tile directly, so you can have something like Greenhaven next to something like Evad River Confluence, and it would make perfect sense.
Also note the reinforcements travelling between sectors.

Now, initially you would only have a couple of planets like this in a solar system; just enough to cover the different worlds: green, ice, mars, moon, acid. You can even have ice and green on the same planets.

As the player base expanded, and the map base, you simply add more and more planets for people to battle on.
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Zoombie
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Post by Zoombie » 02 Jun 2005, 04:55

<Whistles appreciatively> that is a NICE map and pic! That is actually one of the best representation I have seen for a really long time. I like the whole ETA├óÔé¼Ôäós on the reinforcement. So will the Commanders in the endangered territory be able to call for help/ fortify. Will their be some kind of planetary radar network that you could set up, so that you know WHEN a enemy is coming? It would be interesting if their was some ├óÔé¼╦£Dead zones├óÔé¼┬Ø around the maps that had no metal or geo├óÔé¼Ôäós but where just endless, mountainous terrain. So you could send out some plains and set up radar and some picket line├óÔé¼Ôäós out their. Imagine sending a scout force and seeing a massive column of CORE units marching towards your territory. Then you├óÔé¼Ôäód be able to perhaps mine the way their, or perhaps nuke them from orbit!
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[K.B.] Napalm Cobra
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Post by [K.B.] Napalm Cobra » 02 Jun 2005, 05:31

Damnit, wheres NMDange when you need him?
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Warlord Zsinj
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Post by Warlord Zsinj » 02 Jun 2005, 07:37

Well, as I see it there would be a general announcement to all players such as:

<UNKOWN_PLAYER IN SECTOR B3 HAS REQUESTED REINFORCEMENTS>

<BLANK_PLAYER IN SECTOR B2 HAS SENT REINFORCEMENTS. THEY WILL ARRIVE IN 15 MINUTES>

<REINFORCEMENTS FROM SECTOR B2 ETA: 10 MINUTES>

<REINFORCEMENTS FROM SECTOR B2 ETA: 5 MINUTES>

<REINFORCEMENTS FROM SECTOR B2 ETA: 1 MINUTE>

<ARRIVAL OF [ENEMY/FRIENDY] REINFORCEMENTS IMMINENT>


So both players would know that the reinforcements are on their way, and can prepare accordingly. Of course, the opposing player would know which side the reinforcements would be coming from, and so could prepare an ambush for their arrival (such as mines, or units, etc), whereas the friendly player would need to open up a friendly corridor for their arrival. It makes the game very interesting.

--------------

Technically there is a mistake in that image. Unless you allow the GW server to strip garrisons and send reinforcements to help you, reinforcements should only be able to travel between CONTESTED (yellow) zones. Not between a conquered zone and a contested zone.
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Kixxe
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Post by Kixxe » 02 Jun 2005, 14:35

Could work, but should the reinforcements (those whitout a player behind them) move real (moving from sector to sector from exit to exit to anoter sector) or just data?

I think that energy and metal should be a resucouce restrikted to one sector, unless you bring some whit you (mobile energy/metal containers?)
That would open upp a new kind of ''food'' element to the game. Picture 50 units in a place whit low sunlight, no wind and no water (tidal) energy, and since all of them need a litte energy to operte half of them are on standstill...

Btw, i got and idea for space maps. They could just be maps whit only water in transparent coulor, and no sun. Stars we can have as hig ''moutins'' (in oceans?) whit whit coulor on them. Add a star backround and volia!
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SinbadEV
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Post by SinbadEV » 02 Jun 2005, 16:46

If we can get enough players to support it we could set up one FREAKING HUGE MAP, and you would only be able to see/control units that were withing a certain range of your commander, so only that much of the map would need to be loaded into memory at the same time... you could even go a sep further and make the HUGE map a sphere... you could then have all that space battle stuf happen in real time on the same map you would just have to zoom out further to see any of it.... ships could crash down to the lower level and be repaired by land units... it would be reduculousely high server load though, the commander would only be able to see his surroundings but the server would have to able to keep track of where everything is at all times. There wouldn't be any "territory" just fortified, self defended bases of resource collection... resources would be limited to the same range as the commander, if the com can't see the resource collection then it can't use it, but if you have a moho mine and a fussion plant and a factory spitting out peewees and move your commander out of range it would keep spitting out peewees... or whatever it's programmed to do... so you could set up an automated defensive net and leave an area alone producing re-inforcements until your ready to go get them, things like radar would "report to the commander" so you could get radar coverage on stuff radar towers withing range of your commander could see.

I'm not sure if this would be feasable but I think it would be cool.
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Warlord Zsinj
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Post by Warlord Zsinj » 03 Jun 2005, 02:09

Reinforcements are just players swapping units. In the previous example, the player in sector B2 donated reinforcements, so they were removed from his game.

Player B3 will recieve those reinforcements on the map side that they were sent from, using the spawn list (which is entirely possible), and they recieve those units after a certain amount of time. There would be no direct contact between players in B2 and B3. The player in B3 would just send out an urgent call for reinforcements, which would be sent to the Galactic War server, and then sent into all adjacent games. If a player can donate units, he selects the units, brings up the "share" screen, and clicks (a button needed to be hardcoded) "send to embattled ally". Then the units are removed from his screen, and he doesn't see them anymore, and continues with his game.
However, he transmits to the GW server the amount of units which have been sent, which then calculates travel times, and sends the data to the player in B3.

Sinbad, that wouldn't work. My suggestion works within the frame of what Spring has to offer currently, with only minor adjustments, and what I have seen in TA's Galactic Wars. Your suggestion would take many, many hours of development time; and it might not even be fun.
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Zoombie
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Post by Zoombie » 03 Jun 2005, 06:19

Iv alsway's wanted to add some sim city elements to the game. See if youv been reading the Spring: Total war thing i think that the civilian population could be one of your enemy;s, but syphoning of reourses to pay for their education and public services. Peacemongers would cut funding to the war effort, while warmongers will cut funding to the war effor on general prinicpal. maby an entire breed of the less violent players that think CREATING a civilisation is more fun then destroying one (they are rare, but they exsist). These players would manage new territory's, do some intertradeing and in general try to incress their power by building more and more epic city's. Some player's could also increes their terrorty (and hence their controll of resourses and hence of the millitary) by funding certin comander's and haveing them take over resourse hevey terriotry's. Then you could have an entire political system where the fighters on the front have their leashes held by politionts in the back lines! of coures, seince the fighters realy only care about blowing crap up and haveing a good time (or they wouldent be PLAYING spring) they probebly wouldent mind much. Also they get a portion of the mony the pooloticean make's. Maby once a single poloticeion controlls lets say... most of a planet (about 75%) then they can try to succed from their soveren goverment. This would make them a new hostile enemy (their old goverment) but it would mean more mony for them and their comanders (of coures assuming they succed too). Then theses belligerent (or not) "pirate" nations can take up jobs raiding supply lines, sacking planets and generaly causeing a ruckuss. Eventualy the galaxy map would be dotted with rouge goverments, some would ally themselves and become new clongomerates. Corperations could mine entire planets and sell their resourses to both the CORE and the ARM, and anyone else who is buying! Eventualy it might come to where both the original side's are wiped out, and the nutral party's can start killing each other for mony, wealth, power and presteiige. Also if you own the galaxy you can brag to every one else on the forums "Hey guy's i own the known univers!" Then the server could be reset and we can all start it agin. Maby the core and the arm will develope peacefull relations and the only wars will begainst the TLL? See this whole thing can be added to the Glactic War thing i have herd so much about
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Warlord Zsinj
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Post by Warlord Zsinj » 03 Jun 2005, 10:21

Erm zoombie, please don't forget about the whole Word thing. I got about half way through that post and then just gave up...

Responding to the general gist of it:

Everyone seems to want to add massive amounts of complexity to the game. What they really want is Spring as a MMORTS :p

But in reality, you have to think of things in a far more logical and feasible sense. Spring can't do all the weird and wonderful things that you guys have been suggesting.

It can already do what I have suggested. All that would need working on is the Galactic War interface.
With (comparatively) minimal effort, you could have something as I mocked up above working online. Probably in a few weeks, if there was enough interest.

I included "Neutral Forces Present" in the neutral territories just to stimulate discussion about it; because there was talk in another thread how the scripts could be used to have neutral forces that are in essential locations, but would take a large amount of forces to defeat (and perhaps open up a weakness for your enemy to exploit) etc.
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