Its time to remove the engine restrictions - Page 4

Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Various things about Spring that do not fit in any of the other forums listed below, including forum rules.

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MasterBel
Posts: 158
Joined: 18 Mar 2018, 07:48

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by MasterBel » 20 Jun 2019, 02:30

very_bad_soldier wrote:
19 Jun 2019, 18:19
The devs seem to accept this outcome and basically force the players to directly connect to Mando's server (or become a game dev and fix BA etc. etc).
Actually – they don't even need them to fix BA ! There are people who have already done as much as they can to get BA working on Spring 104 without having any playtesters… I can't because I'm on a mac and *still* can't get linux working, but they're not forcing players to do anything! There are options! They're only forcing them *not* to play 6v6 +
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Forboding Angel
Evolution RTS Developer
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Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Forboding Angel » 20 Jun 2019, 08:42

Peet wrote:
19 Jun 2019, 04:41
It only doesn't have any devs because you guys somehow managed to be too toxic for even forb.
So the thing is that I'm not actually toxic (probably was very toxic at one point years ago, but not anymore). However, if someone pulls a knorke on me, I troll very hard. *shruggie*

I'll just leave this little gem here:
Image

Slurp slurp boiiiii


Also, are we ignoring that Silentwings already fixed BA for 104 but they refuse to use it?
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very_bad_soldier
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Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by very_bad_soldier » 20 Jun 2019, 13:59

Forboding Angel wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 08:42
Also, are we ignoring that Silentwings already fixed BA for 104 but they refuse to use it?
I guess I am part of "they" in your eyes and you keep claiming over and over again that I refuse to play fixed versions: please enlighten me: Let's say I come back from work tonight and I feel like playing 1 or 2 games of BA. What exactly do you recommend me to do?

(And yeah, I am totally fine with playing/testing latest BA10/PA/WhatevA.)
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raaar
Metal Factions Developer
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Joined: 20 Feb 2010, 12:17

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by raaar » 20 Jun 2019, 17:24

I guess I am part of "they" in your eyes and you keep claiming over and over again that I refuse to play fixed versions: please enlighten me: Let's say I come back from work tonight and I feel like playing 1 or 2 games of BA. What exactly do you recommend me to do?

(And yeah, I am totally fine with playing/testing latest BA10/PA/WhatevA.)
well, you could revert the trend by doing what the "BA rebels" did:
1- consistently stick to your BA version, wait in the room if you must (there's always something else to do on the internets while you wait)

2- ask others to join your room

3- go into mando's server and ask people to join the official server to join your room, avoid playing on mando's server

4- spread propaganda to boost your cause : they rejected as "alien" newer versions that a casual player could barely differentiate from 9.46, then turned a restriction that only affected large team games on that specific version into an "offensive ban" that deserves harsh retaliation, maybe you could do something equivalent to emphasize how evil mando and his followers are and the dangers of empowering them.
^--------- joke...?


i'd go for BA 10.x to avoid the confusion that comes with rebranding as absolut annihilation or phoenix annihilation (even if the actual content gets remixed with stuff from them).

this will probably not get you many games on the first day, or first week, but if you stick to it and get others to do the same, you can revert what the BA "rebels" did.

bonus points if you manage to get people to play BAR instead!
Last edited by raaar on 20 Jun 2019, 23:04, edited 2 times in total.
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PicassoCT
Journeywar Developer & Mapper
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Joined: 24 Jan 2006, 21:12

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by PicassoCT » 20 Jun 2019, 17:37

You know this was all about upgrading outdated software- but if we are the villain, can we be the at least a great villian?

Cut mandos lobby of from rapid or something like that?
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Ares
Posts: 314
Joined: 19 Mar 2011, 13:43

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Ares » 20 Jun 2019, 19:51

dev: players are ungrateful, upgrade engine BA yourself
player: give us repo access
dev: we do not trust players, also we are leaving forever and redirecting official BA website to our new project

dev: players should only use official lobby, we can't support you if you move to 3rd party lobbies
player: we want to use official lobby
dev: you are now banned from official lobby

dev: old versions are a security risk, players must be protected from mando
player: we only play that version right now
dev: you have to play on mandos host then

dev: engine ban does not target BA players specifically
player: why can't I play BA anymore, but all the other mods work fine
dev: coincidence, you are very ungrateful for our hard work

dev: players don't care about new engine
player: new engine is good, just need to fix balance before you upgrade
dev: old engine versions are now banned, we are pleased to announce the release of our new mod with the balance players have been complaining about aimed at "a new audience", goodbye
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PicassoCT
Journeywar Developer & Mapper
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Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by PicassoCT » 20 Jun 2019, 20:34

Ares wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 19:51
dev: players are ungrateful, upgrade engine BA yourself
player: give us repo access
dev: we do not trust players, also we are leaving forever and redirecting official BA website to our new project
non-retarded-player: i clone it directly from the github : https://github.com/Balanced-Annihilatio ... nihilation

dev: players should only use official lobby, we can't support you if you move to 3rd party lobbies
player: we want to use official lobby. We hate you... we demand that you write software for us..
dev: you are now banned from official lobby

dev: old versions are a security risk, players must be protected from mando
player: we only play that version right now. And complain like bitches in the board for months how we are trolled. Not lifting a finger though.
dev: you have to play on mandos host then (Yeah freedom of choice)

dev: engine ban does not target BA players specifically
player: why can't I play BA anymore, but all the other mods work fine
dev: all the other mods updated there game - old other mods wont work either

This one is the kicker though:
dev: players don't care about new engine
player: new engine is good, just need to fix balance before you upgrade
dev: old engine versions are now banned, we are pleased to announce the release of our new mod with the balance players have been complaining about aimed at "a new audience", goodbye
A engine does not need to fix balance anything. Engine is there to engine, for all games equally- any balance, behaviour or otherwise, needs to be implemented by gamedevs. If your game needs old borkness to work and new engine features uncover that- the onus to fix is on the gamedev.

If your commander has not polygon underwear beneath his kilt - suddenly reflecting engine water enhancing his shiny metall ass - are your problem, not the waters problem.

Nobody wants to dev for the ba community- thus i guess the new audience. And hell if you dont like it, do you own version. Got to leave it to mando, at least he takes some stand alone action, making his own host. Most ballsy guy in the whole whailing widdow tower that is BA.
You could all be alot more like the new Mando, you would have your BA ported in No Time.

But you did not even ask for the sources, or help.
You want to play, without having to work for it. Which is not how this works, and we wont get played.
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Megatron
Posts: 36
Joined: 14 Feb 2018, 00:42

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Megatron » 20 Jun 2019, 21:51

very_bad_soldier wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 13:59
Forboding Angel wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 08:42
Also, are we ignoring that Silentwings already fixed BA for 104 but they refuse to use it?
I guess I am part of "they" in your eyes and you keep claiming over and over again that I refuse to play fixed versions: please enlighten me: Let's say I come back from work tonight and I feel like playing 1 or 2 games of BA. What exactly do you recommend me to do?

(And yeah, I am totally fine with playing/testing latest BA10/PA/WhatevA.)
I'm also fine with later versions of BA10/PA/etc. The problem is we are forced to go where everyone else goes, and they have coalesced on Mandos server because most people were happy with the status quo. Anyone suggesting we simply convince people to move to these versions on the official server doesn't understand the user-base. The user-base moves like a flock of birds. Neutral people like VBS and I are in the back and must go wherever the flock takes us. That is why the only real solution at this point is to remove the engine restrictions and allow the BA flock to migrate back to the official server.

I am still waiting for a reasonable excuse why the restrictions are still in place. I have yet to hear any rational explanation. Anyone who thinks that this decision, which resulted in more than half the spring-RTS user-base leaving the official server, was the right choice must be suffering from some type of insanity or just has total disregard for the players.
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Megatron
Posts: 36
Joined: 14 Feb 2018, 00:42

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Megatron » 20 Jun 2019, 22:01

It seems to me that if the devs want BA to be updated to the new engine, banning the old engine is the worst way to go about it. The devs/admins don't seem to understand how to persuade people; or they simply don't care and are trying to spite BA because of their personal grievances with certain members of the community. They are taking out their hatred, biases, and preconceived notion of "BA players" on us, as though we are all one homogeneous group.

Read up on reactance in psychology, and you would know that you're probably reducing the chance anyone will ever want to update BA to the new version, as evidenced by the BA community migration to a private server. I believe that if the devs want BA to be updated they should remove the restrictions, and perhaps in time someone will step up and update BA in a way that everyone can accept. What the devs have done by banishing the BA community is ensure that the update, that they claim they want us to do, will never happen.
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dansan
Server Owner & Developer
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Joined: 29 May 2010, 23:40

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by dansan » 20 Jun 2019, 23:10

Three (!) game developers have updated BA to work with a recent engine version - every time their work has been rejected - by the so called BA community.
This has been explained to you various times in this thread. But here you are, writing that it is the engine devs error, that BA was not updated.
Do you even read what others write? Or for that matter - do you even read what you write?
Also: there is not a single post by you that is without allegations.
I can only conclude that you are a troll, not interested in sincere communication, and are wasting everyone time.
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Bigfonzie2
Posts: 4
Joined: 12 Jun 2016, 20:39

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Bigfonzie2 » 20 Jun 2019, 23:19

I really want to return to all versions of BA, to the Main Official Server one day.

How can we promote this engine or BA if unique Server details are needed....

BA 9.46 was stable, so I don't see why it was such an instant decision to remove it, and that's a real shame.

If we are not working towards re-unifying this small community, then what really are we doing? Just messing around with an Engine (whichever it may be_) , with no real game-play or team enjoyment.

How can I recommend trying Spring Engine to people, if there are no Matches available?

What a waste of such a quality RTS.

We must build towards something that can work for everyone.

PEACE
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Megatron
Posts: 36
Joined: 14 Feb 2018, 00:42

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Megatron » 20 Jun 2019, 23:38

dansan wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 23:10
Three (!) game developers have updated BA to work with a recent engine version - every time their work has been rejected - by the so called BA community.
This has been explained to you various times in this thread. But here you are, writing that it is the engine devs error, that BA was not updated.
Do you even read what others write? Or for that matter - do you even read what you write?
Also: there is not a single post by you that is without allegations.
I can only conclude that you are a troll, not interested in sincere communication, and are wasting everyone time.
So its been updated and rejected... whats your point? Stop being so resentful and just unban 103. You seem to go out of your way to find reasons to attack people personally or attack the BA community as a whole, all while failing to provide any evidence for why the ban should remain or who its hurting.
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dansan
Server Owner & Developer
Posts: 1190
Joined: 29 May 2010, 23:40

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by dansan » 21 Jun 2019, 00:13

Megatron wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 23:38
Stop being so resentful
You seem to go out of your way to find reasons to attack people personally
all while failing to provide any evidence
Thanks for making my point :lol:
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Megatron
Posts: 36
Joined: 14 Feb 2018, 00:42

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Megatron » 21 Jun 2019, 00:27

dansan wrote:
21 Jun 2019, 00:13
Megatron wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 23:38
Stop being so resentful
You seem to go out of your way to find reasons to attack people personally
all while failing to provide any evidence
Thanks for making my point :lol:
Why are you so toxic? All we want is to play on the official server. All we're getting is personal attacks, weak excuses, and drama from you and the others. You should be ashamed of yourself.
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raaar
Metal Factions Developer
Posts: 808
Joined: 20 Feb 2010, 12:17

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by raaar » 21 Jun 2019, 02:09

As people said, Megatron is sealioning.

If the BA community wanted to just play, most would be playing on some of the BA 10 rooms. Apparently what they want is that the admins to acknowledge they were "wrong" and revert their decision.

This is not about facts, this is about perception, about saving face, about egos. That's why they keep distorting the facts, calling it a "ban", rejected the non-restricted BA versions: to teach the admins and devs a lesson.

Admins aren't perfect, but the BA community totally blew this out of proportion.
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Forboding Angel
Evolution RTS Developer
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Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Forboding Angel » 21 Jun 2019, 02:22

Megatron wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 23:38
dansan wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 23:10
Three (!) game developers have updated BA to work with a recent engine version - every time their work has been rejected - by the so called BA community.
This has been explained to you various times in this thread. But here you are, writing that it is the engine devs error, that BA was not updated.
Do you even read what others write? Or for that matter - do you even read what you write?
Also: there is not a single post by you that is without allegations.
I can only conclude that you are a troll, not interested in sincere communication, and are wasting everyone time.
So its been updated and rejected... whats your point? Stop being so resentful and just unban 103. You seem to go out of your way to find reasons to attack people personally or attack the BA community as a whole, all while failing to provide any evidence for why the ban should remain or who its hurting.
It's exactly the same as 9.46 but running on 104.0. So what you're really objecting to is anything different than what you had, regardless of the fact that that difference is completely superficial.
Megatron wrote:Stop being so resentful and just unban 103.
How about, instead of wasting everyone's time and pissing off anyone who could possibly help you, you play hide and go fuck yourself?
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Ares
Posts: 314
Joined: 19 Mar 2011, 13:43

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Ares » 21 Jun 2019, 02:34

Forboding Angel wrote:
21 Jun 2019, 02:22
play hide and go fuck yourself?
You says player criticism of hostile devs is unjustified and then proceed to swear at a player?

BA10 is not a replacement for BA9.46 and PA is not BA. None of these 3 things are interchangeable, all have unique identities. Only BA9.46 on new engine would be a worthy successor.
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Aquanim
Posts: 9
Joined: 19 Jun 2019, 12:10

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Aquanim » 21 Jun 2019, 02:50

Ares wrote:
21 Jun 2019, 02:34
BA10 is not a replacement for BA9.46 and PA is not BA. None of these 3 things are interchangeable, all have unique identities. Only BA9.46 on new engine would be a worthy successor.
What specifically makes playing viewtopic.php?f=93&t=39426 on the SpringRTS server a less acceptable substitute than playing BA on Mando's server?

If a list is made perhaps it can be fixed.
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Ares
Posts: 314
Joined: 19 Mar 2011, 13:43

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Ares » 21 Jun 2019, 03:00

Thats PA, as I explained in my previous post BA and PA have separate identities. Saying PA is BA is like saying Coke is Pepsi.
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Aquanim
Posts: 9
Joined: 19 Jun 2019, 12:10

Re: Its time to remove the engine restrictions

Post by Aquanim » 21 Jun 2019, 03:02

Ares wrote:
21 Jun 2019, 03:00
Thats PA, as I explained in my previous post BA and PA have separate identities. Saying PA is BA is like saying Coke is Pepsi.
I understand that that is PA. As per Silentwings, PA is a "minimal effort migration of BA9.46".

What would need to be changed about PA to make it have the same "identity" as BA?
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