Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Various things about Spring that do not fit in any of the other forums listed below, including forum rules.

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scifi
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Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by scifi »

myself i have the beta for around a year

been playing it at least once a week

truth to be said i dont think starcraft will ever compete with TA or spring for that mater, they are in diferent leagues, gameplay is diferent.

so one isnt worse or better than the other regarthing gameplay

Interesting facts:
-some TA players dislike or find it unfun starcraft II gameplay
-other rts fans find it too straigth foward and time oriented.

so truth be told:
starcraft isnt the holy grail of RTS, its a game like other but due to the great combination of aspects like grafics, easy to understand gameplay mecanics, somewhat fun gameplay (dependant on taste), it makes it a worthwile game.

i play both starcraft and spring as complement of my rts tastes........


Spring doesnt need fancycliking to make it more playable, i think that the great gameplay you see is taken away, by grafics, poor interface,

it isnt just an instal executable and play rigth away,
the hard steps to play spring.
1┬║-find the website
2┬║-lobby,instalation (TAS, or spring lobby)
3┬║-maps,mods downloads
4┬║-lack of a single player(this should be the area where people could start to like the game, heading on the multiplayer may make people wonder this is shit.................(and having ai libs is good but it doenst make an easy acess to a noob)..............
5┬║-inicial interface and grafics make the time spent in downloading maps and mods irritating to the player
(it takes a while to acustom to a new grafical set), comparison with the blomy style of new games.
6┬║-there isnt enough 1v1s or 2v2s to start= bad learning curve = bad gameplay experience
7┬║-few people fewer games, more waiting, less time playing....
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Hobo Joe
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Hobo Joe »

sc2 still has all the same problems sc1 except for one, and it still uses the horrible mechanics blizzard has been using for 15 years. They haven't changed them, it's amazing.
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Lolsquad_Steven
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Lolsquad_Steven »

lol noobs...
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KaiserJ
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by KaiserJ »

the only thing starcraft has over spring/TA moddage is that you get a fancy jacket and some korean poontang if you're good

the trick is to include them as features in the next engine version
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Forboding Angel »

Hobo Joe wrote:sc2 still has all the same problems sc1 except for one, and it still uses the horrible mechanics blizzard has been using for 15 years. They haven't changed them, it's amazing.
They haven't changed them because blizzard is making money hand over fist, why would they change them?
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scifi
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by scifi »

Lolsquad_Steven wrote:lol noobs...
well dude i was on platinum league

the one before diamon league in the beta
i know that doesnt qualifi me as a pro, but certanly not a noob......

and to be honest if a certain game mecanic works why change it at all, but bare in mind they altered it at least thats my opinion.
starcraft II is very diferent from SCI in terms of gameplay,
1┬║faster
2┬║more unit choices, and abilities
3┬║diferent eco, 2 vespene geysers
4┬║diferent air role, protoss air is so diferent now
5┬║more micro
6┬║probe harasement
7┬║proxy pylon building on enemy base to make units near the enemy
8┬║faster expantions
9┬║quicker counters, enemy has 3 banshees make 1 phoenix gg
10┬║slower counters enemy has hidralisks, you need to overmake zealots plus charge, or dark templars with imortals

everything is prety mutch diferent, in terms of costs and balance, the basics remains the same, but the rest, way diferent........
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Gota
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Gota »

Seems that what didnt remain the same are ONLY the cost and balance.
Last edited by Gota on 06 Jun 2010, 12:27, edited 1 time in total.
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Forboding Angel »

Ya know, on a side note, if someone has 3 uncloaked ban(cheese? =D)shees and doesn't ahve the presence of mind to make a single viking they deserve to lose. Unfortunately I see this happening a lot. Terran players going all in into banshees with little regard of how to protect them.

I figure that you have basically a 1 in 3 chance of your opponent making mass stalkers and rendering your viking useless, be hell, you can still land them and do probe harass with them, so useless is a bit of a stretch. Meh well, anyway...
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JohannesH
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by JohannesH »

Lolsquad_Steven wrote:lol noobs...
good point i agree
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scifi
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by scifi »

lol johannes i was talking about popularity man

why starcraft has more people than spring

personaly i said it i enjoy both games,

starcraft is about fast counters and risky tactics, that dont work so easily
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Gota
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Gota »

scifi wrote:lol johannes i was talking about popularity man

why starcraft has more people than spring

personaly i said it i enjoy both games,

starcraft is about fast counters and risky tactics, that dont work so easily
Starcraft is popular because its a quality commercial product with tons of marketing and its a second game in what is now the most acclaimed and most popular RTS franchise.
Spring is a hobbyist game with tons of bugs with no single player and most of its community is circling around games with fallible legal background.
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CarRepairer
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by CarRepairer »

scifi wrote: 2┬║-lobby,instalation (TAS, or spring lobby)
3┬║-maps,mods downloads
2&3: Run SpringDownloader and click on Join Game.
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Wombat
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Wombat »

scifi wrote:lol johannes i was talking about popularity man

why starcraft has more people than spring

personaly i said it i enjoy both games,

starcraft is about fast counters and risky tactics, that dont work so easily
marketing

graph

marketing

koreans

marketing
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scifi
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by scifi »

CarRepairer wrote:
scifi wrote: 2┬║-lobby,instalation (TAS, or spring lobby)
3┬║-maps,mods downloads
2&3: Run SpringDownloader and click on Join Game.


thats the thing car repairer SD doesnt come in the latest package
if i recall correctly

and it fails for some people

its good for me though
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CarRepairer
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by CarRepairer »

scifi wrote:
CarRepairer wrote:
scifi wrote: 2┬║-lobby,instalation (TAS, or spring lobby)
3┬║-maps,mods downloads
2&3: Run SpringDownloader and click on Join Game.


thats the thing car repairer SD doesnt come in the latest package
if i recall correctly

and it fails for some people

its good for me though
SD is included in the Spring installer.

And call me crazy but I believe there have been a handful of people who have found fail in either Tasclient or Springlobby at times. I vaguely recall some complaints on the forum about lobby clients.
Master-Athmos
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Master-Athmos »

Well I watched a lot of SC2 matches during the last weeks. It seems to be a very decent game just like its predecessor but I still don't feel like playing it in any competitive way. For me it's too annoying and there's not enough "strategy" involved. All this sending in a probe for scouting and harassment resulting in nothing but mindless clickspamming just as things like building stuff to block the ramps and then oops two Zerglings rushed through and you have lots of fun with microing you Zealot or whatever you have after them - I hate stuff like that as for me that's "work" but not "fun". I think that fights between two reasonably good players also get decided by who orders his units to attack the ones weak to a certain attack rather than having something properly planned out. Ordering every single of my troops again just is work for but not fun and especially not "strategy". I also would probably ragequit when "stupid" air drops on hills with no access happen - pure annoyance for me which is why I'm gonna buy SC2 for it's campaign (which Blizzard always stages nice) once it gets a little less pricey...

What I found interesting though is that in some commentaries they spoke of "T3 units" like e.g. the Ultralisk. I found that interesting because I never heard that for Starcraft before as it's more about having a special building to get something rather than having seperate tech trees...
==Troy==
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by ==Troy== »

SC1-2 is the classics arcade of RTS, like Q1-3 was classics arcade of FPS MP shooters (and DOOM was SP classics).

I personally dislike SC due to its simplicity and the feel of round-based-ish game still. (especially the fact that the game "squares" are so big)
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Forboding Angel »

Master-Athmos wrote: What I found interesting though is that in some commentaries they spoke of "T3 units" like e.g. the Ultralisk. I found that interesting because I never heard that for Starcraft before as it's more about having a special building to get something rather than having seperate tech trees...
Not entirely true, for example in terran you have the starport which is for air units, the rax which is for marines maruders/infantry stuffs, and the factory which is for siege tanks and thors and stuff, so the tech trees are still separated, but it differs from race to race.
Master-Athmos
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Master-Athmos »

Sure there exist seperate "roads" you have to follow to get certain units. It's just that I never would have used a term like "Tech 3" in this context. There might be a halfway excuse for Zerg as they have to upgrade their hatchery to get certain buildings up. For Terrans and Protoss I see no fit though and here it seems like Battlecruisers and the Colossus seem to be looked at as "T3 units". I don't see any fit for this term though as those units don't really have any advantage in terms of a higher "tech level" giving them something like a better bang for bucks but they simply are big and expensive units which still can be easily countered by units at lower "tech levels" and are a mere choice to use them as a new strategy but no units of higher value...

But well - maybe that were just some stupid commentaries... :wink:
scifi wrote:6┬║-there isnt enough 1v1s or 2v2s to start= bad learning curve = bad gameplay experience
Actually I don't think this is a downside - at least not for TA based games. Any newbie will just get overrun by any decent player which should be pretty frustrating. In team games you have way more chances to watch other people's play and try to copy that improving your play. The downside probably is that your teammates will shout at you for your sucky play... :wink:

When compared to Starcraft your point also isn't really valid at all. Blizzard recently has allowed 3v3 and 4v4 and it actually seems to suck as Starcraft really is build upon the whole 1v1 thing. There exist some videos of tactics which can be used in games with more players and which are a 99% victory tactic like 4 players sending 2 Zerglings each to one enemy totally crippling that one and making Zerg pretty unfair in games with many players - winning the following 3v4 usually isn't a big deal...
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Forboding Angel
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Re: Starcraft II and spring (popularity)

Post by Forboding Angel »

Well actually you're right about that. Most of the t3 units in sc2 are special case units. Like the mothership, cloaks units below it but dies from a loud fart.

Carriers are ok, I mean they're essentially a knockoff of the broodlord.

Colossus (spelling?) are more of a t2 units i would say tbh, because most protoss players will go stalkers > Immortal > Colossus + Extended Thermal Lance in that order. Also they aren't very strong.

You almost never see ultralisks, almost never to the point where I can't actually remember what their special ability is.

Imo, the broodlord is prolly the only unit I would really consider as deserving of the t3 brand because the lings that it shoots are winsauce.

I dunno, the mothership isn't terrible, but it's slower than shit on a hot summer night and really doesn't do THAT much damage. Ball of stalkers, hydralisks, or +1 (or more) marines with stim? GG mothership.

Tho I must say I love the thoritary fortress, that's pretty win :-)
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