Spring RTS Engine

Recently I rage quit from a game very early on. Most of the time I'm a good player and well behaved, but if my allies ruin the game for me, the host messes up or the game just turns out to be horribly misconfigured, ie unbalanced I'll rage quit (or to have mercy on the team defeating me if it will take too long for them to finish me off). Why be nice to my allies and quit give when they are lousy or have no respect? I'm a firm believer in tit for tat.

The host PMs me and has a little tantrum which is fair enough, and whines about be being permbanned from his games. No issue, I can host big 8v8 battles myself anyway and its his prerogative.

It's easy for everyone to spot that I rage quit an left a huge hole in the line and that gets them mad. It would be easy for them to assume that I quit because I'm a sore loser which is certainly not true. What isn't so easy to spot is the disrespectful activity from the parasites on either side of me.

This has happened time after time and it is VERY frustrating:

I build my starting base, some basic resources, an LTT to stop weasal spam and a vehicle plant. I then move my commander forward, ignoring immediate metal spots and going to around almost halfway up the map. I start building a defensive line to defend my resources so that when I take them I can actually hold them.

Then what happens? While I'm spending resources building defenses, my allies on either side steal all the metal spots that I have secured (between my start base and front line). So I invest in allot of resources defending the metal spots which are between my base and the enemy, and my allies don't spend anything on securing resources and just leech crawling behind me like some kind of pathetic scavenger.

As well as taking away the reward from my investment, because they are wasting cons building on my metal spots they are not building at the front or holding the line. I get overwhelmed by the enemy forces (as I'm alone at front and being distracted by having to suddenly rush back to grab what few spots are left) that are actually doing the right thing while my allies are busy stealing my metal spots.

If I left the spots free for ages then it might be acceptable for them to grab them. However I'm not talking a huge amount of time here, the first thing the parasites build is metal extractors even though they shouldn't have the production capability to stall. To a small extent I don't mind if they steal a metal extractor here or there and especially do mind if it takes a very long time for me to be able to claim the spot with a mex. I wont tolerate the extreme though.

There will always be quarells over metal spots from time to time for obvious reasons, but sometimes it is totally overt who has the right to a metal spot. The repetitive nature of this kind of poor team play is why I point it out here.

Hopefully now that players read this they'll actually start to have some respect, realise the horror they have been inflicting on other players and think before building on any metal spot they can find. I'm sure some people don't actually mean to do this and never thought about it that way before, if you're one of those well consider yourself now enlightened.

Just to clarify what I'm talking about here is not "porcing" but is similar, a failure to expand appropriately and under your own steam.

Rage quitting to some may not be the best way to respond, but from my perspective it provides a lesson in empathy, certain people make me angry and I'll make them angry, then they have some idea what they are doing to me. It's harder to ignore a quarter of your team blowing up simultaneously than a message saying please stop stealing me mexes!

From my experiance, being that I often use the same strategy as you, the problem is the expense you're putting into LLT in the first place that causes you to be overrun, not your allies taking your metal spots. If you build LLT before your enemy do, you cripple your economy early on and your economic curve moves slower than theirs does.

Additionally... it's not really a problem that your allies take 'your' metal if you're playing a defensive game. You choose to play a late tech game if you play a forward D game, there is no getting around the fact. If your allies are doing their job and providing forward support in response to the extra metal spots they have taken, it's better for the team in the long run, because they have a more adaptable position and will be able to tech faster, as well as outspam your opponents in the early game.

At the end of the day, adapting to the actions and strategies of your allies is just part of the game. If you specifically communicate that X metal spots are yours and you need them for X reason, than that adds more weight to your complaint, since your ally is intentionally ignoring team strategy requests. However, after that point, if your ally takes a tonne of metal and your team loses, blame it on your ally. The player who takes the most metal has the most responsibility to the wellbeing of his team.

This is the wrong mentality, which 99% of players who play team games have. When playing team games you act as a team, the most beneficial thing for the team is to cap those metal spots as early as possible as then your team earns more metal, which is then used to build units..blablabla. So often i see people moaning that they are "his" metal spots, and moan that faster players around them get them, you can go play 1v1 if you can't handle being in a team game.

However the people taking the metal spots, even though i see this act to be fine, are normally not entirely blameless, as they often don't distribute that wealth to their allies or do an appropriate amount of damage/give help to their allies for proportion of resources they enjoy.

This is not surprising as the level of teamwork I see in games such as DSD 5v5 and such is low to non-existant.

everyone loves the noobs who start between the highest metal spots that is opposed to where the best player on the other team will start, because "i need th metels to maek my buzzsaw plz1"

This is very funny.
Dude..when you play with a team it doesnt matter who takes what metal spot as long as it happens in the fastest way...a team should strive to take all metal spots available to it as fast as possible....it would be stupid of them to leave those metal spots empty till you have the time to take them..

swiftspear:

I agree with many of your points and in many games they are quite true. As I said in my post there are times when I tolerate people taking metal spots that should be mine.

In this particular case the map had no choke points and enough metal spots and starting metal that taking another players mexs should not have been necessary and estabishing a defensive line was very important. The allies who didn't do that where very quickly penetrated by cheap units such as flashes and peewees that would take out mexes anyway. On a side point, there are many cases where you should strive to steal your enemies metal spots not your ally's!

There are many cases where it is not good for a team. For example in some cases where I have had to hold a choke point my self and my allies some others I have needed resources to hold it. My allies take my metal spots when they don't really need them, the enemy comes swarming into the base through my choke point, then I get the blame for losing.

Of course, usually the player with more metal spots has more responsibility however in some cases I may not want to have to rely entirely on my allies to win, I do actually want to participate. Despite that I'm usually very accomodating and in many caes let my allies get more metal spots and play maps practically like they are green fields. However enough is enough.

It didn't help matters in the last game this happened because the allies on both sides of me started taking my metal spots. One had free spots in the opposite direction. Of all the cheek. There were loads of metal spots that were easy to reach and only needed securing because of the map's lack of barriers.

The final point you make has some sad truth to it. If I had drawn lines marking my area from the start it might have avoided conflict. I had to much faith in my "comrades" and expected them to have a bit more common sense.

DZH/PRO:

Your points would certainly be valid on many maps, however mexes are dirt cheap to build. Once you have secured a metal spot, it will take a very small amount of time to build a mex on it as and when is needed. If you secure a spot it is yours, worry about building the extractor later, it's a trivial task. It is harder to secure a spot than to build a mex on it.

The times I'm referring to where this is a problem is on maps where there is enough metal so that as least early on if you grab all the spots you can straight away you wont have the production ability to use them anyway and will just be wasting metal.

I'm not even talking about speed metal here or metal maps. However, speed metal is a good example. In a speed metal game I was playing recently one of my allies, who was a good player regardless, (I've never seen someone build so many adv fusions so quick and he went air not gantry too) built ALLOT of fusions. Being somewhat experienced he knew that power is important on speed metal. Towards the end of the game, when everyone was spamming krogoths my ally was making 80K energy! I was making around 35K. Here is the thing though. Because I am aware that if you produce lots of energy you need to use it my production capability was able to use at least 30K of energy. His was able to use around 15K. I assume either he was intending on sharing the energy or just going overboard. Eitherway, ALLOT of energy was being wasted by our team. Probably around 100K per cycle in total. Resources are important but you also have to make sure you have the production capability so not to waste it. Early on, and very late in a game that can easily happen.

ivory:

I think I know what you're saying, but I'm not quite sure.

Overall... I'm talking about people such as those in that speedmetal game but worse. The horribly short sighted. He knew energy was important so he went nuts making power plants without actually spending a moment's thought into properly distributing his base layout so that as well as demand being met there was demand to meet. But at least he still played well and his mistake wasn't fatal to him or the team. Thankfully his excess didn't make things harder for his allies either. Saying that his laggy CPU was annoying.

The same thing applies to the times when people have stolen my metal spots. The people I'm complaining about? These aren't people playing just for the team. They aren't being nice and taking the metal spots that I haven't gotten yet so that they can spend the metal on units to defend me while I boost my eco with MMs and the like (instead of wasting potential metal income). I'm talking about greedy people who want to be the most responsible, because they want the credit for victory (which is easier when you stole your allies proceeds). But because they aren't that skilled they have to have the most metal spots on the team for that to happen. They want to be the best, not just better than their enemies but their allies too. Or they would rather their ally dies rather than them and they want to make sure that happens. GREED. It's a simple as that.

As many of you have pointed it out there are some situations where it is ok to take metal spots that really should belong to someone else. That doesn't mean that it's ok all the time. Unfortunately many people fail to grasp this. The number of times this has happened to me when it is not ok should be apparent by how much it has aggitated me (which should be obvious in my tone).

I hope that clarifies things.

my early game strategy consists of, At the first two mex spots I put, Mex, Solar, LLT, then a lab, then any other nearby spots, solar, llt and mex. Then Radar and punisher next to my lab (stop crawling bomb threats)

:] Very defensive start and I begin pumping out units.

Feel Free to try this strategy, harrasement against your base is minimized to microing. (Who harrases early on with a slasher?)]

If I have atleast four metal spots on a map where I can initialize kbots to my advantage, then the game is won (providing the other team members don't mess up as I am commonly the last one on my team alive in most games)

- The King

Every second there is an uncapped metalspot, you are wasting potential. Due to the exponential nature of spring economy, the few seconds (or even minutes) will cost you thousands of potential metal later. You could have spent the metal to produce more metal faster or to cripple your enemy, thus losing a lot more metal than the linear 'Im only wasting +2 metal per second, anyway' would indicate.

So if I see a free metal spot with no enemies in vicinity and no mex already queued *I will* queue a mex. You can later ask me to share you that if you feel wronged, and I'm a reasonable guy and will likely share, but remember this: There are no 'player owned' metalspots, only metal extractors.

Consider yourself enlightened. ~~

You ragequit and ruined the game for us. The game which so far we had all enjoyed

edit: he raeg quit i raeg post

you should just have build the metal extractors before making defense. These things are dirt cheap, so they are easily rebuild when the enemy happens to destroy them.

I feel like drama right now so i uploaded some screens

Orakios masterplan to hold the frontline with no mexes, 2 LLTs and 80 DTs
http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/alben ... 393535.jpg

Our Defens line after Orakio blew up
http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/alben ... 306630.jpg

watching the replay I noticed: Orakio was the only one who got his base spammed with raiders cause he had no defenses except for those on his self proclaimed frontline. Also he tried to dgun a HLT without having E. He lost his comm due to stupidity and thus ragequit

edit2: jesus christ I thought you were just a ragequitter but the more I read of your shit the more angry I get. Watch the replay. You sucked.

Didn't you say you were playing a map with chokepoints? Comet doesn't have chokepoints, nor is it a huge deal if you lose 1-2 fringe mexes.

Anyways, I can appreciate you were frustrated, but seriously, it seems quite clear that the problem is more that you don't know the map well than your allies let you down.

- God almighty, Smiter of the sinful, Divine and holy master of all reality

Orakio is being dumb. I'm going to bet you didn't even ask other players to share some mexes with you. I'd be quite happy with allies who quickly capped metal spots. You were also being incredibly selfish by just self-ding - if you don't want to play anymore just leave. At any rate, WTF kind of strategy is building 10 row deep DT in a short area?

BTW, Complicated, you signed your post "- The King". Stop being so arrogant.

Seriously, ragequitting over that is ridiculous, if you can't handle the game, play 1v1 :]

SwiftSpear wrote:Didn't you say you were playing a map with chokepoints?

I had to read the sentence twice but he actually said there were no chokepoints.

1v1 = no choke points. Stop whining :]

Is it a CA feature for lines and text to scale relative to zoom? Or are those just some really thick lines and huge sized font in those screens? How can I draw huge lines (with transparency even?!?!) and type large bold text in Spring?

I think it's a Photoshop feature.

the-middleman wrote: Orakios masterplan to hold the frontline with no mexes, 2 LLTs and 80 DTs
http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/alben ... 393535.jpg

>_>