WE NEED CHAT MODERATORS

[Das Bruce]

/kick Min3mat

[FizWizz]

Min3mat /pwned by Das Bruce

[smoth]

And no ignore button or chatfilter would stop an offensive conversation taking place. A moderator would. Closing your eyes for a problem (/ignore) does not mean it's not there. I say fix the problem, do not ignore it.

Howerver action to a problem is rediculous for something as minor as WORDS. So I fight moderator. This is not a forum where the text will stay. The text scrolls past and making an effort to ignore would only be problematic if it was a spammer. So an ignore feature would be all we need for problem people. Moderators confront and start shit with flamers who will login at other ip's create new accounts and hack shit to piss off the moderator.

Your foolish to think that you can moderate jack shit when the chat client is open source. An ignore feature though... the person would never know they were on someones ignore list and hence would not know to start shit. we don't need diddly-bubkis. We can USE an ignore but moderation is fucking retarded. It birngs the community closer to the piss and moan crybaby aspect of things. I would prefer to ostrisize over expell a user so I fight you because your notion is foolish.

Those who would give up freedom for security deserve neither.

[Das Bruce]

That last statement is a tad silly, everyone gives up some freedoms for security.

Just one example would be that we give up the freedom to murder people to help prevent others from murdering us. Its a tad over the top for a comparison but I found it ironic that you say that considering where you live.

[SwiftSpear]

You get no freedom here. Spring is hosted on private servers and any access you have is entirely priviledge, and not your right. Hackers aren't the trump of the internet system. Malicious hacking is illegal and when reported to internet service providers, more often then not results in consequences being leveled against the offender. Most successful web comunities have a policy of reporting any malcious hacking that takes place against them, and I don't see why it would be any different here.

The rules aren't very complicated here. Just don't spam.

[Doomweaver]

How about an automatic function in the lobby that bans anyone with
"http://taspring.clan-sy.com/wiki/Monthly_Topic_Rotation"
in there post? I'm getting so tired of that damn thing!

[smoth]

That last statement is a tad silly, everyone gives up some freedoms for security.

Just one example would be that we give up the freedom to murder people to help prevent others from murdering us. Its a tad over the top for a comparison but I found it ironic that you say that considering where you live.

And I find that people like you think they know me because of where I am from. You people need to start thinking outside of your small minds.
http://taspring.clan-sy.com/phpbb/viewt ... 1&start=54

[smoth]

You get no freedom here. Spring is hosted on private servers and any access you have is entirely priviledge, and not your right.

Sry about the double post but I don't want to include you with das bruce's dribble.

True enough, swift. It is partly because SY has done enough already that i do not want to further impose on them

Hackers aren't the trump of the internet system. Malicious hacking is illegal and when reported to internet service providers, more often then not results in consequences being leveled against the offender. Most successful web comunities have a policy of reporting any malcious hacking that takes place against them, and I don't see why it would be any different here.

The rules aren't very complicated here. Just don't spam.

True enough and I didn't think about that counter defence. However, could we really report circumventing such measures as malicious hacking? That is interesting I was unaware of this. Why do the game companies not inforce this to reduce the already ramapant cheating going via similar hacks?

[Maelstrom]

Hacking a server with the intent to cause damage is different to modifying game files to gain an advantage. The formaer is illiegal, and the latter is not. (well I think it might be, but that is not an issue for the ISP's to sort out.)

[smoth]

that is what I am saying. you wouldn't be hacking the server. You would be in the case in question using a hacked client. I am not trying to go against it I am just just trying to get a better understanding of the hacking issue.

[SwiftSpear]

Like maelstrom said. Modifying game files to gain an advantage isn't strictly malicious hacking. You legally purchased the game, and with that the ability to modify it's files. It's an issue with the game companies what a user does to files they distributed, not that user's ISP. ISPs don't take kindly to people using thier service to illegally access other people's server property. Internet access is not a right.

[edit] client is hosted on a private server. Hacking client is as illegal as registering hotmail accounts with the intent to spam.

[RedDragon]

I don't know anything about hacking, but i still fail to see why anyone would have a problem with having moderators.

And since we're doing examples, how about this:

A 13 year old logs on for the 1st time, with a clean "ignore-list". Within 15 minutes someone goes on a rampage against black people (or any other group of individuals).

What do you think he or his parents would say if that's their 1st encounter? I think if his parents would see that, he'd be disallowed to ever log on again, potentially taking away a future expert Spring player.

This community is growing, and that's a good thing. But seriously Smoth, do you really feel no responsability for protecting minors or minorities against racism, flaming or offensive statements?

Spring is a great game, with a great service. A LOT of people are volunteering to improve the game, creating utilities, maps, mods etc. It's their effort too that will mean nothing if Spring became known as a hostile place. And i'll repeat my statement

"What harm can a moderator cause to you if you play nice?"

And don't gimme crap about powertripping moderators; they'd be demoted within a day.

[smoth]

yeah, like all those times when a kid is playing a violent bloody shooter and the parent crap themselves over someone saying "BITCH"...


I don't think so.

This community is growing, and that's a good thing. But seriously Smoth, do you really feel no responsibility for protecting minors or minorities against racism, flaming or offensive statements?*edited for spelling*

No I don't because minorities have enough bleeding heart wimps and idiots catering to them. While they all the while call each other N*GGER. Or how about all the children who USUALLY are the ones acting like jerks on the server. Protecting them from racism... omfg grow up. They see that every day, are you going to go and personally stop the KKK or neonazis hell no. However, I am sure the community would chastise and humiliate the individual teaching children that this sort of though is WRONG! Instead of letting kids innocently stumbling onto that sort of thing.

Protecting them from flaming... geez. yeah and the next thing you are going to tell me is that their parent NEVER curse in front of them. Or the massive explosion of profanity on television. flaming is nothing more the getting overlysensitive and personaly attacking someone. I don't know like all the childish fights in school yards.

Or how about offensive statements... they hear that everyday at school. Children are being too protected and not preparing them for the real world. We are not putting them in labor camps are placing them as thralls in war. We are exposing them to language, language that they will likely hear at school or from their parents. I mean for christs sake we are not talking about the hot coffee implementation/mod. We are talking about WORDS. People like minded to yourself have a tendency to think we can sit here and protect them. People get offended, there are people who get offended if I say the XBOX is better then the PS2. I draw the line at learning to just deal with it or learn to strike back. Considering this thread you know which one I am.


If the child has to be in a pristine environment we are opening the door to the whole bit of piss and moan sensitivity. Worry all the time about offending someone is ridiculous. Worrying about racism... that is retarded when it is prevalent throughout the world. Hell, lets just worry about everything like... female circumcisions... or child slavery... or child molesters asking ASL in spring.. because you know child predators saturate the gaming community. We cannot even through a moderator protect children. You cannot control ingame chat where things will get heated and there will be violence present which doubles the concern of the parents. PFFFT.

[Guessmyname]

On the subject of protecting kiddies from being flamed: half the time they deserve it or start/cause it (playing Dystopia - a HL2 mod - some winey 12 year old wanted to be the decker, but everyone else wouldn't let him because he was crap and acting like a complete arse-retard combo)

Overtly-Hormonal gits

[AF]

When I want a battle, I prefer it to be in spring than in the lobby. If you want to swear and shout obscenities, then fine, create a seperate channel and do ti there, otherwise I think the main threads of chat and help have an obscenity free policy. I dont like people showing off their insults and flaming eachother, but I cant say they have no right to say those things, just nto where I am.

This could go as far as there being an option in the lobby wether we startup in #main or #lurid.

[smoth]

hmm good idea atlantia. We could have a warning pop-up before the lurid chat that tells them it may be offensive. That way the "sensitive" types can get their arses in main.

[RedDragon]

No I don't because minorities have enough bleeding heart wimps and idiots catering to them. While they all the while call each other N*GGER. Or how about all the children who USUALLY are the ones acting like jerks on the server. Protecting them from racism... omfg grow up.

It seems it's not me who needs to do some growing up, especially considering i have not insulted you, nor intended to do so. And correcting typo's is definately showing your (lack of) matureness. And if you're think you're so smart, try replying to this in my language. http://www.learndutch.org

And about the content of what you're saying:
You seem to be unable to put yourself in the shoes of someone who would be offended. Have you ever realized it can hurt people's feelings?

Protecting them from flaming... geez. yeah and the next thing you are going to tell me is that their parent NEVER curse in front of them.

"Yes, if happens there. it's ok if it happens here too."
That's the dumbest possible reasoning i.m.o. Won't spend any more time on that one.

Or how about offensive statements... they hear that everyday at school. Children are being too protected and not preparing them for the real world......
...... language that they will likely hear at school or from their parents.

Idem.

.....we are not talking about the hot coffee implementation/mod. We are talking about WORDS.

Words can cause more damage then you realize, obviously. Ever heard a speach of mr. Hitler? They're very exciting. Why? Because he has a way with words. And to make it clear: the content is something i absolutely don't want anything to do with.

Worry all the time about offending someone is ridiculous. Worrying about racism... that is retarded when it is prevalent throughout the world.

What you call "retarded" is what i call "social", which is a skill you seem to lack. Perhaps grabbing a dictionary (not for the correct way to spell it, but what it actually means) would be a good thing for you.

You cannot control ingame chat where things will get heated and there will be violence present which doubles the concern of the parents. PFFFT.

I never said i want to do this. All i said was to have the MAIN channel as FREE AS POSSIBLE of offensive language. What happens in game is beyond anyones controll.

[Zoombie]

Kids who cuss there mouths off are jerks.

Plan and simple. I know people YOUNGER then me swearing mabey....five to twenty times as much. Its acctually kindof depressing. BUT i found one line of resoning actualyl works really well. Heres what happened

12 year old Kid: "God damn thats good f!@#ing shit! -continues on in same vein for a bit-

Me: "You know swearing has more of an effect if you use it spareingly"

Kid: "errr.... your right"

[SwiftSpear]

Keep that in mind as well, this game isn't Rated, and if it were it's very doubtful it would be 18A. We very well could have really young kids coming and playing, sanctioned by thier parents. We should keep all the available public avenues at least work safe. That is, forums, and #main. Private client channels and other gathering points are independantly responsible for thier user base, and if they allow for youngsters to idle and attend, and allow stuff to go on that would offend thier parents, well that's thier own perogitive.

[smoth]

it seems it's not me who needs to do some growing up, especially considering i have not insulted you, nor intended to do so. And correcting typo's is definately showing your (lack of) matureness. And if you're think you're so smart, try replying to this in my language. http://www.learndutch.org

I noted that because some people can get bent out of shape if you quote them and change even the slightest bit of their text. However, take it however you want.

And about the content of what you're saying:
You seem to be unable to put yourself in the shoes of someone who would be offended. Have you ever realized it can hurt people's feelings?

indeed I do and I think that feelings should get hurt sometimes as it helps people to grow. however, trying to save people from being offended is folly.

"Yes, if happens there. it's ok if it happens here too."
That's the dumbest possible reasoning i.m.o. Won't spend any more time on that one.

but you made it a point to single it out for response... so you did.. mind taking at work here :).

Idem.

and here :)

Words can cause more damage then you realize, obviously. Ever heard a speach of mr. Hitler? They're very exciting. Why? Because he has a way with words. And to make it clear: the content is something i absolutely don't want anything to do with.

WOOT PUPPET! you did it awesome I knew you'd do that... sweet! Godwin's Law ftw! It has no relation to someone NEAR as powerful as Hitler and his words were only fueling a fire that was already there. his EVIL came from the actions his people did. Anyone can spout anti-semitism but we are not talking about a country already on thee brink of war.

What you call "retarded" is what i call "social", which is a skill you seem to lack. Perhaps grabbing a dictionary (not for the correct way to spell it, but what it actually means) would be a good thing for you.

As condescending as ever. Again, I was just noting a modification to a quote not correcting your spelling. However, it should be noted that I am(not bragging just stating a fact) a verbal genius. Insulting my intelligence just proves to me that you are staggering for ground. I would have preffered stronger opposition but this is not your primary language so I can just leave that thought on the fact that you are at least polite enough to converse with me in my native language. This I will at least give you respect for.

I never said i want to do this. All i said was to have the MAIN channel as FREE AS POSSIBLE of offensive language. What happens in game is beyond anyones controll.

I didn't say you were but you arguement on that point was "parents will observe the children in the chat" or something similar I am too lazy to look up the quote. Anyway I was simply stating that even for your best efforts controlling speach is not going to happen as you cannot also moderate the game in which the player should be 3X or 2X the time in.

I am not upset but considering that this is your second language I am leaving this at your misunderstanding. I will continue to debate with you on the matter but know that this is not important enough for me to care about and hence something I don't take personal. I just think that this debate should and must happen so I am making that happen. You shouldn't take this thread or my manipulation of you personal.

I am a moderator on several boards. I know it is a lot of work and a lot of the problem people often leave in time. As I stated earlier this is just a scrolling chat we are talking about moderators would be killing a fly with a cannonball. When the text scrolls on by and there are no permanent entries I think so far an ignore button or perhaps firestars suggestion maybe the way to go. I am completely against moderators for this exact reason. You do not speak english and have misunderstood many of my statements or completely missed them. You should not be a moderator anywhere there is english speach... so who here would be qualified? I know no one person who is omnilingual.